Why Do So Many People Get it WRONG?

[Officially Retired]

Sorry to be negative, but this game has to have the dumbest people in it on the planet.

The confusion as to the color black (and a red nose) is absolutely astounding to me.

Folks, if your dog is NOT black ... he will not THROW black. (The only "exception" to this is if the dog is chocolate, which is a dilution of black.)

People always confuse dominant and recessive, to the point of retardation :embarrassed:

It is very simple: black is dominant / red is recessive.

If you have a red dog that means he has LOST the black gene and canNOT throw black. Only way to get a black dog from a red dog is to breed the red to a black.

If the black gene is in there, the dog will BE black. If the dog is NOT black, he has NO black gene.

It is only the red gene which, being recessive, can all of a sudden pop back up out of nowhere, if it happens to align with another recessive (and therefore hidden) red gene. NOT the black gene. If the black gene is there, then it shows itself regardless of any other gene being present. That is why it is CALLED "dominant."

Pardon me for the outburst, but I just had to have a morning rant after reading several pages of utter ignorance on another forum :lol:

Jack

[act284]

What about nose color?

[bulldogsrus]

I thought it was about nose colour.

I always found this interesting reading :

http://www.adbadog.com/p_pdetails.asp?fspid=101

[Officially Retired]

Same deal.

[gabbagabbahey]

Jack,am i not right in believing blue also to be a dilution of black & therefore can produce black ?

[Officially Retired]

Not exactly sure on blue, but you may well be right. I know chocolate and seal are like that.

What I do know is, because black is dominant, if it is present in the dog then it is physically expressed, meaning the animal is black (even seal and chocolate are forms of expression, albeit diluted).

If the color black is not expressed, then it has been lost. This can happen if a black dog with a recessive gene mates with a red/buckskin dog with a recessive gene, and the recessive genes are what pass on to the pups. In this case, the black is lost and only then can the recessive color traits be expressed.

Jack

[gabbagabbahey]

I asked a more educated man a long time ago why is blue seen in such quantity in a working staffordshire bull terrier line. I thought maybe another breed brought this to the fold & it was hushed up. Anyway he told me that blue is a dilution of black & it is caused by a lack of "Menalin".
When i thought on it,i bred a black dog out of a blue sire x white & red dam. The dam having no black dogs in at least 5gen if not more. In truth the same could be said of the sire.
Any opinion on the lack of menalin,Jack ?

[Officially Retired]

Melanin is what I think you're referring to do, and it has something to do with dark pigment.

In humans, when a mole on the skin becomes cancerous, it is called a "melanoma" and moles themselves have something to do with "melanin" ... but the exact science behind it is not something I've studied to any extent.

Hope this helps ... a little :)

Jack

[gabbagabbahey]

Thank you for the reply.

[tasoschatz]

The gene that produces the dilution of a color can be found also in animals with beize color etc. The major colors suppose to be black and brown and all the others different shades of these two. So it is possible from a breeding between a black dog and a beize one to get some grey color pups, I have seen it happen quite often actually, but it seems to happen somewhat selectively, some dogs produce grey, some seal and some nothing from the above. The same gene also produces blue eyes, the ice colored ones.
I have got the above info from Great Danes' sites, all these "more official and historically followed" breeds do provide good info on such matters due to acquired for hundrends of years data.

[Ez Country]

Recently bred a Black dog to a red red nosed female, got 7 pups none are black, 4 chocolates, 2 red, and 1 blonde. Only 1 has a black nose,

[Officially Retired]

Recently bred a Black dog to a red red nosed female, got 7 pups none are black, 4 chocolates, 2 red, and 1 blonde. Only 1 has a black nose,


The black dog had a recessive rednose gene.

Your 4 chocolates carry the black gene ... albeit diluted ... while the 2 reds and 1 blonde do not :)

Jack

[Officially Retired]

The gene that produces the dilution of a color can be found also in animals with beize color etc. The major colors suppose to be black and brown and all the others different shades of these two. So it is possible from a breeding between a black dog and a beize one to get some grey color pups, I have seen it happen quite often actually, but it seems to happen somewhat selectively, some dogs produce grey, some seal and some nothing from the above. The same gene also produces blue eyes, the ice colored ones.
I have got the above info from Great Danes' sites, all these "more official and historically followed" breeds do provide good info on such matters due to acquired for hundrends of years data.

Interesting, thank you.

Jack

[Ez Country]

A very nice litter so far very young but all the pups are beauty's, the chocolate's have blue eyes, both parents are inbred from different families

[FarmersChoice]

OK I HAD A BUDDY THAT BRED HIS SMALL TINY RED RED NOSE BITCH INTO A BIGGER BLUE WATCHDOG/MCB CROSS THE WHOLE LITTER WAS RED REDNOSE SOME WERE MAYBE CHOCOLATE OR LIGHT RED RED NOSES AND THE OTHER HALF WERE BRIGHT BLACK JUST A LIL THING THAT CAME TO MIND WHEN I WAS READING THIS TOPIC

[bxpits]

Ch red gator is a dirty red rednose dog out of two buckskin blacknose parents, my shitfire bitch is also out of buckskin blacknose parents, she is a blonde rednose. Both dont resemble there parents but othere dogs back in there pedigrees and both are not closely related. When I bred them together I got all rednose dogs to my surprise not even 1 blacknose.
Both dogs have 1 rednose grandparent I should add.
So now what are the chances of there offsprings together producing blacknose dogs?

[FarmersChoice]

TWO RED RED NOSE DOGS DONT MATTER THE SHADE WILL ALWAYS PRODUCE ALL RED RN LITTERS DONT MATER WHAT EVERY TIMEI HAVE SEEN IT OVER AND OVER THREW THE YEARS

[abc]

a friend just had a litter dam is a double bred boomer bitch (red, red nose) and the sire is a honeybounch x jeep (dirty buckskin ). littler of 7 i think two of the pups are black,

[Officially Retired]

a friend just had a litter dam is a double bred boomer bitch (red, red nose) and the sire is a honeybounch x jeep (dirty buckskin ). littler of 7 i think two of the pups are black,

Guarantee that "red/rednose" is simply a mis-identified chocolate/rednose ;)

Jack

[CRISIS]

jack are you referring to the bullyson thread over on peds online referring to that linebred crackerjack dog comming out buckskin with a red nose???

[Officially Retired]

I can't remember which thread anymore, lol, as there are HUNDREDS of threads that get started over nose color :lol:

[CRISIS]

true, i just found it funny that you posted this JUST as i was reading that over there........btw, did you ever get my latest pm? not sure if it went through or not....