YARD ACCIDENT ?

[blockbuster brigade]

CAME HOME TO A YARD ACCIDENT.SMH!!!! MY QUESTIONS IS CAN A HOUND FULLY RECOVER MENTALLY FROM 1?HE CULLED 1 & WALKED AWAY FROM ANOTHER,BUT WHEN PLACED IN FRONT OF THAT HOUND HIS SPIRITS WHERE STILL THERE.WHAT WOULD YOU DO DOG MEN & WOMEN?

[Officially Retired]

How old is the dog that quit?

If it's young, I wouldn't worry about it.

If it's older, and schooled, it simply quit.

Jack


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[blockbuster brigade]

THANKS FOR REPLYING JACK,HE'S 2 1/2yrs I HAD HIGH HOPES FOR HIM. :(

[YigYang]

Usually you are saposed to wait at least until they are 2 years of age, where as you are giving your pet time to mature.
U have claimed your pet to have been 2 1/2 years old, i would say he has matured and turn on, but i can be wrong simply because some dogs mature at diffenernt times and rate's and also i have never owned or seen him.
U have been with him since a pup so i u should now if your boy turned on yet,
what does he do when you bring him close around another hound?

Just keep in mind that any dog can quit depending on how much you put on him

[blockbuster brigade]

I am not 1 to make axcusses for my hounds,I feel I will never get any where doing that.But,there are some factors that my kennel partner brung to the table that I will consider.He will be healed and looked at & I will let yall know how he pans out. ;)

[Bojacc357]

If he walked away he would have to go. Still no one was there to say what happen. Maybe the other balled up and submitted and he isn't a finisher. I still wouldn't be ok but I've seen those type win and a game one make them finish them cause they want submit.

[Condmach]

Although this bulldog would have "no" place on my yard, this is a decision you will have to make.

There are no rules in this area, only an allowance of temperance depending upon the owner. I for one follow a strick guidline as it relates to gameness and the breed.

Your decision is yours!

[TFX]

I have seen a well known 2X winner that was deeply game and had finished a dog simply walk away from 3 dogs he mixed it up with in a yard accident situation. Outside of the box is a totally different deal IMO. I had an old dog that I could call off of a cat if he was chasing one, and who ran around with a Cocker Spaniel and a Labrador on camping trips. When you stepped over a wall though, he would go with anything including a bitch. I wouldn't evaluate a dog in a yard accident situation, or any situation outside of 4 walls. On the flip side, how many have "killed one" in a yard accident that couldn't fight their way out of a paper bag in a real roll or show? Inconsistincies in yard accident situations flow both directions, and thereby hold little bearing on how I would feel about a dog.

[Officially Retired]

I have seen a well known 2X winner that was deeply game and had finished a dog simply walk away from 3 dogs he mixed it up with in a yard accident situation. Outside of the box is a totally different deal IMO. I had an old dog that I could call off of a cat if he was chasing one, and who ran around with a Cocker Spaniel and a Labrador on camping trips. When you stepped over a wall though, he would go with anything including a bitch. I wouldn't evaluate a dog in a yard accident situation, or any situation outside of 4 walls. On the flip side, how many have "killed one" in a yard accident that couldn't fight their way out of a paper bag in a real roll or show? Inconsistincies in yard accident situations flow both directions, and thereby hold little bearing on how I would feel about a dog.

Interesting rebuttal. Have to rub my chin on that one.

I am not sure that what a dog did "before" in a match has any effect on what he'll do the next time out ... as there have also been dogs that were 2xWs, deeply game in the last showing, who just quit in the next match to "a different dog" the next time around. So what about that?

Case in point, the 2xW Poncho/Mayday dog Murder beat a 6xW Grand Champion for #2, and yet when he faced an unusual adversary (that was a freak-mouth dog that grabbed the paws, and broke them off, he couldn't take that and quit.

IMO, sometimes dogs who show exceptionally-game "once" ... just don't have it in them to "go through that again" ... and, in other instances, dogs that will show "dead game" to one dog ... whose style they're used to ... can get confused and quit to a badass dog who whips their ass in such a way they've never experienced before.

Jack


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[blockbuster brigade]

If he walked away he would have to go. Still no one was there to say what happen. Maybe the other balled up and submitted and he isn't a finisher. I still wouldn't be ok but I've seen those type win and a game one make them finish them cause they want submit.Not an excuse but the second hound was a female that he walked off from.That is why I said I woud test him again,because I wasn't there.

[Officially Retired]

Okay, I musta skipped that.

My Truman dog refused to fight my Red Angel bitch also (so did Gr Ch Hank), screamed and hollared when she got on him (he was "in love" with her) ... but he hated males and went out DG to one.

Poncho, on the other hand, would kill a bitch same as a male.

Jack

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[Bojacc357]

Yeah with a female they might have scrap cause he tried to mount her but wasn't really fighting to finish her. I would give him another shot.

[TFX]

The fact of this deal Jack is that he was in keep for #1 when this accident happened which caused a forfeit. He had already gone through a final schooling roll that was harder than any of his two shows. So the yard wreck was sandwiched in between a real display of gameness, and two highly impressive wins in top competition. He hurt three dogs in the wreck who were all 10-15 lbs smaller than him, and they did nothing to him that would have caused him to quit, but when he was done he went back the his chain spot loose and kicked back.

Every case is different, but I know that 4 walls makes a big difference with some dogs. A dog that quit in a yard accident or even a dog that killed one in an accident doesn't sway me much either way. Plenty of "yard accident killers" can't seem to duplicate the feat inside of 4 walls for whatever reason. I think some dogs although they will fight in a yard accident, really view it more like play time since the human bonding as a dog-handler team is taken out of the equation.

[wildchild]

TFX,

I know what u mean when u say that they dont display in the woods what they display on the chain. I had a good one get killed in a kennel mishap & then the killer quit in under :30. What I didnt pay attention to is how the killer killed the good dog.

What happened was the killer got in the backend and streched out the other dog, yanked, pulled, & shook the dog until he choked the other dog out pulling him against the chain.

Did he kill the dog ? yes!
Is he a killer? Hell naw!

He didnt have his tag team partner,the chain, in the woods with him & thats why he quit :lol:

wildchild

[Officially Retired]

The fact of this deal Jack is that he was in keep for #1 when this accident happened which caused a forfeit. He had already gone through a final schooling roll that was harder than any of his two shows. So the yard wreck was sandwiched in between a real display of gameness, and two highly impressive wins in top competition. He hurt three dogs in the wreck who were all 10-15 lbs smaller than him, and they did nothing to him that would have caused him to quit, but when he was done he went back the his chain spot loose and kicked back.

Sounds more like he lacked finish/cannibalism than he quit.






Every case is different, but I know that 4 walls makes a big difference with some dogs. A dog that quit in a yard accident or even a dog that killed one in an accident doesn't sway me much either way. Plenty of "yard accident killers" can't seem to duplicate the feat inside of 4 walls for whatever reason. I think some dogs although they will fight in a yard accident, really view it more like play time since the human bonding as a dog-handler team is taken out of the equation.

True, and ultimately you are the best judge as you were there.

I think Wildchild gave a great account of how a non-finishing cur can "finish" one in a kennel wreck, by unfair advantage, but can't do the same thing with a badass dog his size in a box.

Jack

PS: Nice avatar w/ the old-timers, old-timer :mrgreen:

[BME]

another couple months of feed water and so on will not matter. wait and see for your self. He's yours. I had one get of the chain and get into her daughter. She walked off or was run off I beleive the latter but I have gotten good dogs from her . Oh yeah, that same daughter didn't make the grade she pulled up

[H.B.K.]

I have to say I can understand ur delimma being it was an accident and u werent there, but once he got to fighting that faucet shouldnt of stopped running regardless the reason. jack i understand the different reasons a hound can cur. but that doesnt make it alright and if i come home to a yard accident the one who is loose better be dead or still competing!! If ur behind or back in ur box then there is a hound who is not deep game, and in my eyes not part of the program.

[Vdk]

Y'all ever experienced a dog who got loose, but didnt try to "compete" with another animal? I mean got loose and ran by the others back to the house and just sat at the backdoor? Just curious. This is unrelated but I Gotta admit the funniest thing I ever witnessed with these dogs was I went out to feed my dogs one day and a male I have had slipped out of his collar but didnt realize it. Was running his chain space barking as usual. But wouldnt go any further then his chain would usually allow him. LMAO Then when he saw me walking towards him he tried to lunge against his chain like he does when excited and realized he was loose. Needless to say I had to take a chapter outta Clark Kent's playbook and lay out like Superman to detain him before he made contact with my old Frisco stud. He is hands down the dumbest animal I own. But he's honest himself.

Vdk

[mistabud]

Y'all ever experienced a dog who got loose, but didnt try to "compete" with another animal? I mean got loose and ran by the others back to the house and just sat at the backdoor? Just curious. This is unrelated but I Gotta admit the funniest thing I ever witnessed with these dogs was I went out to feed my dogs one day and a male I have had slipped out of his collar but didnt realize it. Was running his chain space barking as usual. But wouldnt go any further then his chain would usually allow him. LMAO Then when he saw me walking towards him he tried to lunge against his chain like he does when excited and realized he was loose. Needless to say I had to take a chapter outta Clark Kent's playbook and lay out like Superman to detain him before he made contact with my old Frisco stud. He is hands down the dumbest animal I own. But he's honest himself.

Vdk

Not sure if this is similar to what your talking about or not but here's a vid of a well known bulldog palying with another male. Fast forward to 35 seconds.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CICoEAwxFUE

[bolero]

virgil would also sleep with a cat it is called not being a fight crazy idiot. personally i hate dogs like thaty and lkove the ones who will play with pups and chill wit a bitch. most here no bolero, well she and gr ch bronson wpould lay and choill on a couch together, to me that is wat a good bulldog is all about, now would i not take a talented dog if he was fight crazy hell no but i ,like dogs like bolero virgil two eyes stomper and that line in generall i s very docile around pups and dogs who are not turned on. to me that is a great sign of intelkigence and goes a long waty a lot of the greatest dogs were like this

[Officially Retired]

Well said.

I think there is a difference between getting in a yard accident and walking away from a whooping ... and just avoiding a problem when it isn't necessary.

I too prefer dogs that know when to go and know when to relax and be cool. Case in point: Silverback and Dirty Hammer are lying on my couch as I type this, watching the pups Amazon and Beowulf play all over the place :mrgreen:

Jack

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[Pistol]

BlockBuster, I have had this happen to me a couple times when I use to use bullsnaps, and it never ended good. Yard accidents suck because you never really know what happened. I had a 9 month old pup that got hit by a grown male, and when I got home they were rockin' & rollin'. After I got them apart the pup wanted nothing to do with that grown male, but during the accident he was giving him the business. I just held on to him until he was old enough to check, and I ended up with the same results.
I also had a grown bitch get loose by pulling her angle iron out of the ground when it became soggy. I use to weld my chains to 2' foot long sticks of angle iron, but realized then it wasn't long enough. When I came home I found her in the dog house with a 6 month old puppy. They were both jacked up real bad, and the chains were tangled so tight that they looked like one dog with two heads. I got them loose and the grown bitch was trying to get ahold of every other dog on the yard, and the puppy didn't want to do shit. I took the grown bitch right to the barn and learned for the second time that she wasn't a finisher, but she wasn't a cur neither. I let the puppy grow up and just hoped for the best, but he turned out to be a cur. He never acted the same after that attack. He was a very hot and active little pup until the bitch got ahold of him, and after that he was a little shy and cautious around other dogs. I think he remembered that beating well. It was my own damn fault for having my animals on those snaps. I gave the bitch away to some gentlemen who were happy with her, I had no desire to breed her after that, nor did I plan on showing her.

[Officially Retired]

That is the textbook definition of being RUINED.

[TFX]

PS: Nice avatar w/ the old-timers, old-timer :mrgreen:

That is Lou Johnston of GOOFY fame on my right, and Ernie "Joe Viking" Rodin on my left. Ernie owned the GR CH HUMPHREY dog before selling him to Cesar Bon in Mexico where he finished the campaign trail. Ernie had a bunch of great dogs over the years and was a real friend. He was very close to Larry McCaw clear back when Patrick was scooping Larry's yard and living out there. Both of them died within a couple of years of this photo. This was taken at the Spring 1992 show, 20 years ago. CH MERLE won his 3rd that night, CH JULIUS lost deeply game in 1:46, and CH REGGIE won her second that morning of the photo. Oh to be a kid again!

[RDC]

In the end you gotta make that final judgement call..so long as u true to your standards it will only matter to you..no one else's opinion matters!!

[russian]

stop spoiling em and they wont run to the door lmaoooooo j/k which male was it?