Poncho Family of Dogs

[CrazyRed]

I was just wondering where are the dogs now? I know when Jack was breeding them he had them but since he has took a step back to enjoy other facets in life where are the dogs now? The Hornet & Chase dogs? The Uey or Duke Nukem dogs? Silverback dogs? I know a few good guys having success with them like EZ, Scott, WildChild, etc but anybody breeding any of them dogs now?

[ToTheDogs]

The EZ line is finished.

[ponchday]

Here's one http://www.thepitbullbible.com/forum/bulldog_profile.php?dog_id=310

[Milky]

http://www.thepitbullbible.com/forum/bulldog_profile.php?dog_id=10928

[CrazyRed]

The EZ line is finished. No bro, please tell me he wasnt one of them too... Damn shame to hear that, I know he had a lot of success with them. How about Icestorm, I seen his ped and kind of looks like the dog in your pic. heard about a son of his a while back. How is he throwing or is he gone as well?

[CrazyRed]

Here's one http://www.thepitbullbible.com/forum/bulldog_profile.php?dog_id=310

Buddy of mines has one bred almost identical to that.

[ponchday]

You got a ped on it

[Officially Retired]

Will answer in detail later :)

[CrazyRed]

Will answer in detail later :) Thanks Jack it is very much appreciated. I know the dogs you bred around later on were Silverback dogs and I know I use to speak to a guy in the Cackylac that had a few of them. I remember his dogs were of the smaller variety, i just cant remember his name. He use to be on the board a year or two back.

[MISTER]

http://www.thepitbullbible.com/forum/bulldog_profile.php?dog_id=1598

http://www.thepitbullbible.com/forum/bulldog_profile.php?dog_id=6915

http://www.thepitbullbible.com/forum/bulldog_breedingprofile.php?breeding_id=487

[boottopdogger]

Here's one (http://www.thepitbullbible.com/forum/bulldog_profile.php?dog_id=310)
got the brother to that dog sitting next to me as i type .........

[CrazyRed]

Does anybody have any pups on the ground or planned breedings?

[Chase1]

I have a question. I know the poncho dogs have hollingsworth blood running through it's veins. Is there any particular individual living stud that carries a high consentration of hollingsworth blood?

[Officially Retired]

I have a question. I know the poncho dogs have hollingsworth blood running through it's veins. Is there any particular individual living stud that carries a high consentration of hollingsworth blood?

Desert Kennels' Krypto (http://www.thepitbullbible.com/forum/bulldog_profile.php?dog_id=22542) is the highest-percentage Hollingsworth dog (50%) out of any living Poncho dog.

His owner (Parkboy) is a POS in my opinion, but (if the dog is still alive) Krypto is 62.5% Poncho and 50% Hollingsworth (Bull/Truman/Trinx) and should be able to throw badass dogs bred anyway he gets bred ... as he is also 50% Thunder/Screamer (brother/sister) which are the two highest-% Poncho dogs ever.

Jack

PS: I will try to make more posts here as time permits, as I am trying to catch up on book orders over the last 10 days.

[Chase1]

Thanks for replying.

[MISTER]

I believe Krypto is still alive. I talked to parkboy about a month ago. I have these on the ground now. 3 weeks old. Letting 2 M go.

http://www.thepitbullbible.com/forum/bulldog_breedingprofile.php?breeding_id=487

[CrazyRed]

by any chance you have any pics of the pups off that breeding?

[MISTER]

Not right now but I can take some tonight.

[ponchday]

Nice breeding Mister.

[ponchday]

Which brother of Boom do you own?

[MISTER]

I believe Krypto is still alive. I talked to parkboy about a month ago. I have these on the ground now. 3 weeks old. Letting 2 M go.

http://www.thepitbullbible.com/forum/bulldog_breedingprofile.php?breeding_id=487

OK. I have only talked to Parkboy on the phone. After hearing all the shit I heard in the last 2 days, I would not deal with him. I will agree with Jack on the POS comment. I'm glad I never sent my gyp to get bred to krypto, cause I might not have gotten her back.

[bently]

YO JACK , THIS MY FIRST TIME TRYING THE PONCHO STUFF AND THEY ARE JUST FUCK UPS. CHEWS, AND BREAKS EVERYTHING LOL. is this the typical poncho dog?

[Officially Retired]

When you use the word "they" you're implying that "they're ALL like X" ... and reality just doesn't work out that way :)

The truth is, I have bred hundreds of different dogs (if not at least a couple thousand) over the years, and you might be surprised to learn "they're not all alike" ;) :idea:

I will say this, however, MOST of my BEST dogs were either rock-calm or the polar opposite: super-intense. Of the super-intense dogs, yes, they can be destructive, but they're not fuck-ups ... what it is, is that they have HUGE EGOS ... they're extremely intelligent, extremely intense, and they demand attention. Sitting around all day on a chain isn't what they want to do ... they want to work and they want to be with you :idea:

I have found that the biggest "fuck ups" outside are actually the calmest and best dogs inside ... but if they don't get the attention they demand, then yes, many will destroy everything in sight.

Jack

[bently]

When you use the word "they" you're implying that "they're ALL like X" ... and reality just doesn't work out that way :)

The truth is, I have bred hundreds of different dogs (if not at least a couple thousand) over the years, and you might be surprised to learn "they're not all alike" ;) :idea:

I will say this, however, MOST of my BEST dogs were either rock-calm or the polar opposite: super-intense. Of the super-intense dogs, yes, they can be destructive, but they're not fuck-ups ... what it is, is that they have HUGE EGOS ... they're extremely intelligent, extremely intense, and they demand attention. Sitting around all day on a chain isn't what they want to do ... they want to work and they want to be with you :idea:

I have found that the biggest "fuck ups" outside are actually the calmest and best dogs inside ... but if they don't get the attention they demand, then yes, many will destroy everything in sight.

Jack


i keep a rather small yard so they are all walked once a day. have not even had her a week yet. she chews on bowls, barrells, so i put her inside in the crate while weather was bad and this little mofo chewed the cage in less that an hour. she is still a pup and full of energy.

[Officially Retired]

LMAO, how is she bred?

My little Icon (http://www.thepitbullbible.com/forum/bulldog_profile.php?dog_id=3887) dog was like that ... lost all his teeth by 6 months ... constantly dug holes and attacked rocks all day long ... and yet, even with no teeth, was one of the baddest ear dogs I've ever owned/seen in my life.

This was confirmed by the owner of 2 of the best ear dogs that ever lived (Ch Robert T 9xW, and Ch Robert T Jr. 4xW), who called Icon "Baby Robert T" ...

Even without his teeth, the opponent would lose all the hair around their ear (from the top of the head to the jaw muscle) after being with him ... on both sides of their head ... and their ear canals would swell shut to where you could barely get your pinky finger in there :shocked:

Jack

[Officially Retired]

Here are the aftermath photos (maybe a week later) of a dog that Icon got ahold of on the head:

http://www.thepitbullbible.com/images/u1.jpg

http://www.thepitbullbible.com/images/u3.jpg

http://www.thepitbullbible.com/images/u2.jpg


Keep in mind, this was from a dog in Icon, with literally nothing left of his teeth :)

http://www.thepitbullbible.com/images/i1.jpg


But BOY, once he glopped-onto your ear & took the whole side of the head ... he could control any dog for as long as he wanted to.

Truly, he was lightning fast, could spot you weight, and never got tired. He could really pitch a shut-out, and against some pretty good dogs to boot.

Sure do miss him.

Jack

[Black Hand]

That's crazy. I wouldn't have believed it til you posted the pics lol.

[Officially Retired]

LMAO, he didn't just grab the ear ... he'd grab the whole side of the head ... from the center up top to under the jaw ... and he would hold it like a (ahem) VISE 8)

He was a true Vise-Grip dog, and perhaps the baddest pure ear dog I have ever seen. I know that's not a popular style with all these guys who like "killers" (lol) ... but Icon would make a killer look like a clown ... and would pitch a 100% shutout against some pretty damned good dogs.

I mean, when the owner of two of the best head/ear dogs to ever live (the 2 Ch Robert Ts) calls your dog "Baby Robert T ... when he was super-critical on most people's $#!^ ... you have to figure Icon was a pretty impressive lil' head dog :mrgreen:

Jack

[bently]

LMAO, how is she bred?

My little Icon (http://www.thepitbullbible.com/forum/bulldog_profile.php?dog_id=3887) dog was like that ... lost all his teeth by 6 months ... constantly dug holes and attacked rocks all day long ... and yet, even with no teeth, was one of the baddest ear dogs I've ever owned/seen in my life.

This was confirmed by the owner of 2 of the best ear dogs that ever lived (Ch Robert T 9xW, and Ch Robert T Jr. 4xW), who called Icon "Baby Robert T" ...

Even without his teeth, the opponent would lose all the hair around their ear (from the top of the head to the jaw muscle) after being with him ... on both sides of their head ... and their ear canals would swell shut to where you could barely get your pinky finger in there :shocked:

Jack

she is off of bolo. will post ped soon. my buddy owns the homicide dog off of silverback and he says he is the same way.

[gotap_d]

LMAO, he didn't just grab the ear ... he'd grab the whole side of the head ... from the center up top to under the jaw ... and he would hold it like a (ahem) VISE 8)

He was a true Vise-Grip dog, and perhaps the baddest pure ear dog I have ever seen. I know that's not a popular style with all these guys who like "killers" (lol) ... but Icon would make a killer look like a clown ... and would pitch a 100% shutout against some pretty damned good dogs.

I mean, when the owner of two of the best head/ear dogs to ever live (the 2 Ch Robert Ts) calls your dog "Baby Robert T ... when he was super-critical on most people's $#!^ ... you have to figure Icon was a pretty impressive lil' head dog :mrgreen:

Jack

Im like black hand, i wouldnt have believef it either without visual proof. How did icon produce?

[Black Hand]

It would have been nasty had he had a good set of teeth. I wonder if his ruined mouth played a role in his choice of style n he just mastered it.

[Officially Retired]

It would have been nasty had he had a good set of teeth. I wonder if his ruined mouth played a role in his choice of style n he just mastered it.


Yeah, he would have been even more horrible than he was, if he had all his teeth :shocked:

As far as his style goes, almost all my dogs are head dogs, actually (it is what I have always bred for).

Icon just happened to be an ace ... teeth or no teeth :)

[Officially Retired]

Im like black hand, i wouldnt have believef it either without visual proof. How did icon produce?

LOL, I was not exaggerating :D

As for how he produced, Wildchild's Hampton (2xW, 1xL) (http://www.thepitbullbible.com/forum/bulldog_profile.php?dog_id=23860), as well as Screaming Icon (1xL) (http://www.thepitbullbible.com/forum/bulldog_profile.php?dog_id=4430), were sired by Icon. Each of these dogs came off of daughters of Icon's sister Brick House. I bred Brick House to Sun Demon, and took two sisters from this breeding and bred them back to Icon.

Hampton was a great head dog who ran into some foul play for #3, and Screaming Icon lost to a Grand Champion, spotting him 2 lb of weight, 9 weeks after he made a crawling game scratch to win in 1:20, also spotting 2 lb of weight. In top professional hands, fresh, and at his best weight, Screaming Icon would have been very tough to beat. He was not an athlete, but he was a powerhouse supreme with a heavy mouth. Turn the muzzle into soup.

Hampton was an ear dog like Icon, while Screaming Icon was a devastating face dog like his granddam (and Icon's sister) Brick House. Screaming Icon was not an athlete, but kind of a big dope like Sun Demon.

Icon died at 4 so it is hard to say how he was as a producer, but every dog in his litter was a badass dog, including his ace brother Toro, and the rock-solid Joe Manco, as well as Tara, so if I would have bred every bitch I had to Icon, and gotten them in good hands, I am 100% sure that alot more of his offspring would have won than would have lost ;)

Jack

[Majunbu]

Jack, are the silverback dogs this way also? I have a dog who is off a double breed silverback bitch who acts exactly as you describe. If she's in the kennel she jumps up and down, chews her house, climbs the kennel like a monkey. Same thing on a chain. Runs all over her spot and try's to dig to china. One would think she'd destroy the house if she was inside the house. As soon as you let her inside the house she's a different dog. Calm and sits around with the kids as if she's an angel. I have friends who saw her in the house and didn't believe it was the same gyp that was outside. Besides this she's a wonderful dog.

[Officially Retired]

Jack, are the silverback dogs this way also? I have a dog who is off a double breed silverback bitch who acts exactly as you describe. If she's in the kennel she jumps up and down, chews her house, climbs the kennel like a monkey. Same thing on a chain. Runs all over her spot and try's to dig to china. One would think she'd destroy the house if she was inside the house. As soon as you let her inside the house she's a different dog. Calm and sits around with the kids as if she's an angel. I have friends who saw her in the house and didn't believe it was the same gyp that was outside. Besides this she's a wonderful dog.

Yes. "The Gorilla" not only looked like a Silverback, but he screamed like a wild ape if he couldn't get what he wanted. HUGE ego ... and a HUGE desire to be with you. The difference with Silverback, though, is he never destroyed anything. Had a full set of perfect teeth even the day he died as an old man. But he would scream and go (pardon the pun) apeshit on his chain ... but in the house was a great animal. Possibly the best house dog I ever had.

Poncho was a horrible house dog (when I was gone). Would eat his way out of crates, my bedroom, etc. ... all just to get where "I was at" ... he was EXTREMELY LOYAL ... but ... he was born to be on a chain. Only towards the very end of his life, when he was dying, was Poncho suitable to be in the house. But many of his offspring and descendants were truly wonderful house dogs.

Jack

[bently]

Jack just curious,what made you breed a "cold" dog. i know bolo was off of the two gamest dogs you ever bred and turned out to be cold. what made you still breed him? because i know there is something more to it

[Officially Retired]

Jack just curious,what made you breed a "cold" dog. i know bolo was off of the two gamest dogs you ever bred and turned out to be cold. what made you still breed him? because i know there is something more to it


If you already know that Bolo was off of two of the gamest dogs I've ever had, then why do you ask me "what made me" breed to their son? You already know the answer :lol:

Despite the dog's being cold, I wanted to satisfy my own curiosity, nothing more. Rather than ask a bunch of questions online about "what to do" with my own dog, like a retard, I make my own decisions as to what to do with my own dogs. Like a big boy. I always like to know, first hand, what I am talking about on the subject of breeding dogs :idea:

Too many people are encumbered by the insecurity of "What will they say if I do X?" ... but I have never been like this. If I feel like doing X I will do X. I don't need "internet approval" of my actions, nor do I care what "other people think" of my decisions. Further, I personally have debunked so many dog myths on my own that I don't even pay attention to what most dogmen think on any subject, since most just repeat the stupidities "they've been told" on the subject of breeding, without having any real breeding knowledge of their own. I had enough breeding knowledge of my own, and enough knowledge of my own line, to be comfortable (and curious) enough to make the decision I made.

The fact is Pup Pup and Super Red were two terrificly-game dogs and I was surprised that Bolo was cold coming out of two dogs like his parents. Pup Pup was also sired by the baddest dog I have ever owned in my life, Stormbringer, and I did not want to lose his genetics with the last living son of his. When they produced Bolo (http://www.thepitbullbible.com/forum/bulldog_profile.php?dog_id=966), he (for whatever reason) was a cold dog. Super Red was also off of Stormy's half-sister Red Sonja, and I thought I might still have "an ace" in there somewhere, if I could "re-shuffle the deck" right ...

I later learned that Pup Pup, as game as he was, in general (for whatever reason) threw a lot of cold dogs ... and more curs than what I was used to producing with any other stud I have ever used ... which is something I almost never got from my line. So I was wondering where TF that came from, and figured I could get rid of it with another breeding step.

So I bred Bolo to another daughter of Pup Pup, in P'Cola (http://www.thepitbullbible.com/forum/bulldog_profile.php?dog_id=983), to try to double-up on this game dog, in order to see if I could "shake" what I perceived as a bad anomaly out of the "genetic mix" ... and maybe shake back IN an ace level dog ... which can sometimes happen when you "re-shuffle" the genetic deck you have. Nothing more. There have been plenty of well-bred cold stud dogs, that produced awesome, and Bolo was bred down from as game and badass a group of dogs that can be had in our sport.

Also, sometimes an individual dog may not produce that well, as a sire, but he will produce awesome dogs as a grandsire. Pup Pup (http://www.thepitbullbible.com/forum/bulldog_profile.php?dog_id=968) was bred well enough, and was game enough as an individual, that I decided to see if that were true or not. So I did a double-breeding on him to see if I could straighten things out and not just end things with Bolo.

From what I understand, most of the dogs from that breeding were pretty good, with a supposedly badass male, but (also) with one supposedly cold male yet again. It was neither a great breeding nor a bad breeding. Ultimately, it was just yet another breeding I did that produced mostly pretty good dogs. Unfortunately, the ace quality of Stormbringer had apparently been lost altogether in that gene pool. My experiment achieved only average, pretty good results, but nothing spectacular.

Since "pretty good" is not where I wanted to be as a breeder, I dumped all of them and went in the direction of my overall better stud dogs: Icon, U-Nhan-Rha, and Silverback, ALL of whom proved the ability to produce ace-quality dogs (though Icon's breeding career got cut short).

Hope this answers,

Jack

[bently]

i have recently decided to change my route. i got rid of all my old stock and starting fresh.
i have a bitch off of bolo and will be taking her to a son of silverback when the time is right to start my yard back up. I wanted to know how the different strains of poncho line peferom. "in other words" how do the SILVERBACK dogs compare to the DUKE NUKEM"U-NHAH-RHA" and STORMBRINGER dogs performance and trait wise?

[Officially Retired]

i have recently decided to change my route. i got rid of all my old stock and starting fresh.
i have a bitch off of bolo and will be taking her to a son of silverback when the time is right to start my yard back up. I wanted to know how the different strains of poncho line peferom. "in other words" how do the SILVERBACK dogs compare to the DUKE NUKEM"U-NHAH-RHA" and STORMBRINGER dogs performance and trait wise?

All of these dogs are primarily head dogs.

You will get your highest percentages with the U-Nhan-Rha dogs (Silverback dogs are good too). Most Silverback dogs go for the throat, with a rare few truly knowing how to finish.

There are no more Stormbringer dogs, unfortunately, but he was one helluva bulldog. The best I ever had in terms of raw power beyond belief, absolute control of the situation, and the ability to finish absolutely. Yet, ironically, he was the least-consistent producer.

Silverback was more athletic than Stormy, and every bit as much of a finisher, but he made mistakes sometimes (that Stormy never did) and Silverback had only average durability, whereas nothing Stormbringer's size could hurt him. If the other dog was the same size, it almost wasn't even fair, that is how superior Stormy was as a dog. He spotted crazy weight (even against people like Hard Core Kennels), and still absolutely overpowered what was in front of him. It took a 9-lb bigger half-brother to kill an 8-year-old Stormbringer ... and only then because Stormy was the one stuck on the chain ... yet I was still pulling bone fragments out of Poncho Jr's muzzle and upper palate for weeks after he killed the chain-hampered old Stormbringer.

At the same size, and if Stormy was in his prime (and not on the chain_, Stormy could have killed 3 Poncho Jr's ... and Junior was a badass dog ... he was just no ace like Stormy.

U-Nhan-Rha was a rock-solid dog, that wasn't great at anything, but was f***king good at everything. An all around dog, maybe with no finish, but also with no weaknesses. A straight face dog with really good mouth. Not great, but really good mouth. Same with air, brains, durability, etc.

Jack

[CrazyRed]

Where are the folks with this blood now? Are they willing to even part with any?

[Officially Retired]

Redrum and Bamagame dogs have some of my dogs, but they're making a lot of "crosses" from what I can tell.

Not sure if they're being selective and trying to keep it pure or not.

Wildchild has the best Silverback dog I know of in PrimeApe.

[CrazyRed]

Yes heard about PrimeApe, and Red Rum i seen a few of those pedigrees up. I think it was crossed or mixed-fused-intertwined with the Buck stuff (guess bringing some of the bolio back up) which seems interesting. Was hoping some folks would lighten up and open the gates to some of the Silverback & Duke stuff.. Wildchild is good man from my personal convo's with him, wish he would get back on..

[Officially Retired]

Jfcole has PrimeApe's brother, Magilla Gorilla (http://www.thepitbullbible.com/forum/bulldog_profile.php?dog_id=25227), also out of Twilight. From what I understand, Magilla is not a stone-cold finisher, like either Silverback or Prime Ape, but he is brutally-strong, durable, has world class ability, and an extremely heavy mouth (and he is a face dog to boot).

JC & crew have seen (and lost to) PonchoBack (http://www.thepitbullbible.com/forum/bulldog_profile.php?dog_id=177), and they say Magilla is as talented as this great dog was, but far more powerful.

JFCole (http://www.thepitbullbible.com/forum/member.php?81) is a member here and you can contact him if you like. I also believe he has some purebred pups (http://www.thepitbullbible.com/forum/bulldog_breedingprofile.php?breeding_id=580) on the ground too, out of Senna (http://www.thepitbullbible.com/forum/bulldog_profile.php?dog_id=105) (photos taken at 4 months).

Hope this helps,

Jack

[CrazyRed]

Thanks Jack, I will contact him and let you know if I was able to pull twist and get him to let one go..

[scratchin dog]

He had two pups available out of Senna to Magilla about a week or so ago. I dont know if he has sold them yet.

[Officially Retired]

Thanks Jack, I will contact him and let you know if I was able to pull twist and get him to let one go..

He said he's had trouble logging in. I told him to email me, but he hasn't yet. You might want to email him instead of PM ...

[Officially Retired]

He had two pups available out of Senna to Magilla about a week or so ago. I dont know if he has sold them yet.

Thanks for posting. I don't know either, but he said he's tried to login but couldn't.

He is still a Subscribed Member, and I told him I would enter a new password for him, but so far no email.

Jack

[bently]

this lil bitch is off of bolo and is hand full. will be taking her to a son of silverback in the future

[Officially Retired]

this lil bitch is off of bolo and is hand full. will be taking her to a son of silverback in the future

That sounds good :)

[bently]

That sounds good :)

she is young and showing to be a great young dog, very athletic, hyper, intelligent, and extreme focus. I will be taking her actually to my buddy dog in the future. In fact he is out of the same breeding that created amazon. they should both do us well.

[Officially Retired]

Nice.

What is your bitch's pedigree again?

[bently]

Nice.

What is your bitch's pedigree again?

http://www.thepitbullbible.com/forum/bulldog_profile.php?dog_id=23902

planned breeding http://www.thepitbullbible.com/forum/bulldog_testbreeding.php?sire_id=23901&dam_id=23902