Zukill or stormbringer

[Bigfoot23]

jack i have a question it seems as if stormy and zukill were two of poncho's best sons what do you think separated them from the rest of the pack. Also what info if any do you have on how zukill produced.(did he throw the same traits he was know for) thank you

[Officially Retired]

I don't know much about Zukill, except I saw a tape of two of his fights when OG Posse sent them to me.
At the time, I didn't appreciate his style as much as I do now, which was a very powerful, unorthodox finisher.
He scratched low, with his head down, and would come up under a dog and flip them. He liked the throat and the kidneys, if memory serves.

I was more into head/face dogs, and did not appreciate a true finisher like Zukill. Especially considering he had no cutters.
As a producer, Zukill sired a 4xW and a 3xW from just a couple breedings, one to his sister Cry Widow (which produced a Champion Evil).
There was a time when Kingfish offered to lend Zukill to me (as a 3xW) for breeding, and can you believe I declined :shocked:
Wish I had that to do over again :confused:

The reason is I had Stormbringer. I liked Stormbringer's style better: awesome head dog, brutal strength, absolute finisher as well (throat).
Stormy proved to be hit-and-miss as a producer, which was a big disappointment. He did throw a couple of awesome dogs though.
Cherry Coke (not Cola) was a world class bitch, and so was Stone Rose and her sister.
If I could have got Stormy bred to Bandana, and kept those pups to inbreed back to both parents, and if I would have been selective, there's no telling how many good dogs there would have been.

Stormy/Bandana over Ouch/Bandana
Stormy/Bandana over Stormy/Red Sonja
Stormy/Bandana over Stormy/Rosey
Stormy/Big Mama over Stormy/Ch Sally

etc.

But, alas, some bad luck ... and some poor management decisions ... never allowed those goals to be. I bred Stormbringer to 14 different bitches ... and none of them took ... he went sterile at 4-5 years old ... and I never had a chance to build a line on him. He threw some cold dogs, though, but he threw some game ass dogs as well as a couple MONSTER-powerful dogs ... and, if I would have had all those pups come to be, and would have been selective in my subsequent breeding choices, there would be a helluva legacy on the dog, I am sure.

But we'll never know ...

Jack

[bently]

i was hands on with them dogs. i have never seen zuk with my eyes but have seen kids and grandkids of him. my partner owned a grandson of him. I have never seen neither one hunt but if it was up to me zuk without a doubt. zuk was a pure all out powerhouse monster.Zuk was destorying dogs with no teeth. The owner of zuk is on this forum

[Officially Retired]

Hi Bently. Which of Zuk's owners is on here? Kingfish or one of the others? You can PM me if you like.

But yeah, as far as what I've seen, Zukill and Stormy were simply awesome animals with a body strength totally in a class by themselves, matched with the intelligence to do what they wanted when they wanted.

Kingfish said Zukil was one of the 5 best dogs he's seen, which includes Art and Tornado. Wonder if Art or Tornado coukd have won 6 straight, all in under an hour, with no cutters ...

[Bigfoot23]

Bently did zuk throw the traits he had into his pups?

[CrazyRed]

If I'm not mistaken it was said some grandkids of Zukill were up in the midwest area being bred still, I know a few guys who spoke of them. Nobody could verify, is KK on this board? Last I heard he was on hiatus from boards.

[Officially Retired]

I doubt seriously too many of Zukill's pups were as good as he was. If any.

That is like saying, were any of Art's or Tornado's or QueenofHearts' pups as good as they were? No.

When a dog is that good, they pretty much are a "stand alone" item.
Dogs of that quality only come around once or twice in a lifetime, if that, and seldom throw what they were.

They all may have produced good ... even absolutely excellent ... dogs.
But very few freaks can throw another freak like they are.

When breeding, all dogs tend to "revert back to the average" of the line ... which is why it is so important to watch your averages when you breed, as opposed to getting caught up with "individual excellence." :idea:

That said, with 12 wins in one litter, Zukill should have been on rock-solid ground as a producer, since few litters in history have that many wins amongst the litter also.

Jack

[bently]

If I'm not mistaken it was said some grandkids of Zukill were up in the midwest area being bred still, I know a few guys who spoke of them. Nobody could verify, is KK on this board? Last I heard he was on hiatus from boards.

its not true. i am in the in the hometown of zuk and let me tell you that there are no more zuk dogs around. period! you can find a dog with zuk in this ped mabey 5 gens back but that doesnt make him a zuk dog.

this is one owned by my cousin http://www.thepitbullbible.com/forum/bulldog_profile.php?dog_id=21972
LOL kingfish kid always bragged about seeing tornado, because he really was just about the only person from our neck of the woods that seen her.

As far as did zuk throw anything as his cailber is hard to say. Zuk was not bred alot and the litters he did produce where great quality hounds. most bringing game, intelligence, agility, and a natural will to win. Those where some great dogs but most where in the wrong hands at time which is why it isnt around any longer. I have no doubt if Jack would have got zuk back or my buddy would have kept him , it would still be a working line today being able to compete at all levels.