View Full Version : picked up game in 18-22 min
Punishem601
12-18-2014, 07:10 PM
Mostly every kennel outside of u.s always say something like 1xgl in 18 mins.Guys I just wanna know how can he/she be so damn game in that length of time.
Officially Retired
12-18-2014, 07:32 PM
Mostly every kennel outside of u.s always say something like 1xgl in 18 mins.Guys I just wanna know how can he/she be so damn game in that length of time.
It depends on what happened.
Remember, gameness is not absolute.
If the dog was ransacked, but still seemed like it wanted to go back, you can't say it quit. You can only say, "Picked up wanting to go back." (Game)
Does that mean the dog is for sure a game dog?
Nothing means that. Dogs that belly-crawl in 2:25 can always quit the next time.
This is why, ultimately, the term "gameness" is kinda empty in some ways ...
People are always looking for a sure thing, but there simply is no such thing.
Jack
For some it might be a way to say, the dog didn't stop. Not per se game. On the other hand, people like you might think a dog is game if its picked up after an hour. I never use LG.
jawman
12-19-2014, 03:50 AM
It depends on what happened.
Remember, gameness is not absolute.
If the dog was ransacked, but still seemed like it wanted to go back, you can't say it quit. You can only say, "Picked up wanting to go back." (Game)
Does that mean the dog is for sure a game dog?
Nothing means that. Dogs that belly-crawl in 2:25 can always quit the next time.
This is why, ultimately, the term "gameness" is kinda empty in some ways ...
People are always looking for a sure thing, but there simply is no such thing.
Jack
true :-bd
Officially Retired
12-19-2014, 06:49 AM
For some it might be a way to say, the dog didn't stop. Not per se game. On the other hand, people like you might think a dog is game if its picked up after an hour. I never use LG.
Actually, people "like you" don't understand the meaning of the word "game."
Game only means "willing."
You're confusing DEAD game (game until the last breath) with "game" ...
Picked up "game" only means picked up "still willing to continue" ...
A dog picked up at :18, that's badly injured, but screaming for more, most definitely is picked up game ("still willing to continue").
YOUR confusion (not mine) is to think this somehow means the dog was DEAD game or "would never" quit.
The truth is, no such statement is said (or implied) by saying a dog was "picked up game" at :18.
The only thing that is said, or implied, is that, when the dog was picked up at :18, it "was still willing to continue."
And that's it.
Game just means "willing to continue" ...
DEAD game means "willing to continue all the way to the point of death" ...
Therefore "picked up game" is an accurate statement of ANY dog that is still willing to continue at the point of being picked up.
Jack
Sorry jack what are you talking about? Are you trying to explain gameness to me?
I was saying, some people might put LG if they picked up. And some people refer time to gameness, which makes no sense.
Game just means "willing to continue" ...
So when a dog is willing to continue even when its not tired/hot or significantly damaged. You'de use the word game too? I must indeed be very confused then.
Officially Retired
12-19-2014, 12:10 PM
Sorry jack what are you talking about?
If you don't understand, then I can't explain it any clearer.
Are you trying to explain gameness to me?
Yes, in addition to many other things I've had to explain to you.
I was saying, some people might put LG if they picked up. It doesnt mean the dog was willing to continue.
You're confused again. So I will explain again.
A dog CAN be picked up "game" ... willing to continue. (Happens all the time.)
What you're saying is some people MISTAKE (or misrepresent) a "game" pick up, where a dog is not willing to continue, but the owner tries to pass it off as a game pickup.
Yes, Nut, we all know that some people might misrepresent what happened, but that is a whole other issue isn't it? :-w
For that matter, some people misrepresent pedigrees too, but that doesn't mean ALL dogs aren't really papered the way the breeder says, does it?
In the same fashion, so what, some people "say" their dog was willing to continue, when it wasn't, but that doesn't mean ALL dogs aren't willing to continue when picked up, because quite a few are.
So, again, YES, a dog CAN be picked up "game" (willing to continue), but that doesn't necessarily mean the dog wouldn't quit later on.
It only means it was picked up, and still was clearly willing to go, at the time it was picked up, nothing more, nothing less.
Please refer to my original post where trying to infer "absolute gameness" is a folly unto itself.
Thanks,
Jack
What you're saying is some people MISTAKE (or misrepresent) a "game" pick up, where a dog is not willing to continue, but the owner tries to pass it off as a game pickup.
also yes. by not letting it scratch. the dog didnt officialy stop so they think hey lets put LG
or dog that are picked up that are willing to continue, while a Labrador even would have continued.
think w'r not understanding eachother.
Officially Retired
12-19-2014, 12:27 PM
also yes. by not letting it scratch. the dog didnt officialy stop so they think hey lets put LG
or dog that are picked up that are willing to continue, while a Labrador even would have continued.
think w'r not understanding eachother.
You are probably right.
In anything you want to talk about, there could be misrepresentation.
Sure, sometimes people lie (or don't know what they're looking at).
However, strictly-speaking, a dog CAN be picked up "game" (willing to continue) at any point in time ...
However, whether that actually means something of value is a whole other deal :lol:
I think we can both agree on that :mrgreen:
"game' has a lot of interpretations. I have always used the word 'willing' as well. "Willing" simply means 'willing' it has nothing to do with the circumstances. Basically when one is picked up and is willing, he has been picked up game. The only thing absolute about that situation is that time pretty much stopped right there. Anything that might would have happened, or 'was going to happen' is pure conjecture. We do not 'know' what was going to happen. We can use probabilities and past experiences to say what we think but when a dog is picked up and is willing to continue at that particular time he/she has been 'picked up game'.
The dog that laid the 18-22 minute ass kicking could have just as easy quit on top at 23 minutes or they both could have stayed til one died in the box and the other died shortly there after. We simply do not know.
"picked up game' just means at that point in time he was still willing. 30 seconds later, who knows?
EWO
mitchm
12-19-2014, 06:20 PM
This dog http://www.thepitbullbible.com/forum/bulldog_profile.php?dog_id=34399 took out both stifles and I believe killed opponent in just over 3 min. Had opponent scratched back I would call it a gl :)
A lot can happen in 18 min
FrostyPaws
12-20-2014, 09:54 AM
This dog http://www.thepitbullbible.com/forum/bulldog_profile.php?dog_id=34399 took out both stifles and I believe killed opponent in just over 3 min. Had opponent scratched back I would call it a gl :)
A lot can happen in 18 min
Flukes happen in 3 minutes also. He didn't do that before that show or any after.
Agreed. I would count my money like any one else after a 3 minute RIP but I wouldn't let that money ride again on it happening again.
No Quarter Kennel
12-22-2014, 08:59 AM
Mostly every kennel outside of u.s always say something like 1xgl in 18 mins.Guys I just wanna know how can he/she be so damn game in that length of time.
It can happen. Gameness is not relative to only time
Officially Retired
12-22-2014, 09:10 AM
Mostly every kennel outside of u.s always say something like 1xgl in 18 mins.Guys I just wanna know how can he/she be so damn game in that length of time.
People who say things like this typically have never really been in a fight themselves. They have no concept of anything.
18 min = 6 rounds of boxing (without getting five 1-min breaks inbetween).
Now then, you take a stopwatch, and you actually sit there and *time* 18 minutes ... just sit there for 18 minutes :idea:
Now, while you're sitting on your ass for 18 minutes straight, imagine instead GETTING YOUR FUCKING ASS HANDED TO YOU EVERY SECOND OF IT.
Kicked, punched, stomped, dominated, fucked up, thrown, slammed, bit, elbowed, NO RULES, you are getting fucking POUNDED. Just DECIMATED ... until you are ABOUT TO DIE.
You sit there and really think about taking 18 straight minutes of absolute abuse, to the point where you're about to die, and if you had enough mettle in you to "scratch back" to that ...
I doubt that very much. My bet would be you would shit all over yourself, beg for mercy, and would *not* willingly go back "for more" of that type of total abuse to the point of death.
Actually go through something like that first, and until you do, don't ever again and ask "How a dog can be so damned game" in :18 of time, if it really was on the brink of death.
See if some part of that empty space between your ears can register what it might be like to get the living shit knocked out of you for that long, by a truly devastating opponent, before you EVER try to sit there again (all high and mighty) judging the gameness of an animal that is 100x gamer than you :idea:
Jack
CRISIS
12-22-2014, 10:02 AM
i remember gettin into a really big one as a teenager. if you would have asked me how long that shit lasted i would have told you 20 minutes! but in relity, it was maybe 4 or 5...... things are definately not what they seem and that goes double for time when you the one engaging. at the very least it will definately give you a greater respect for boxers who condition themselves to get punched in the head for 36 minutes straight...lol
good post jack.
Officially Retired
12-22-2014, 11:45 AM
i remember gettin into a really big one as a teenager. if you would have asked me how long that shit lasted i would have told you 20 minutes! but in relity, it was maybe 4 or 5...... things are definately not what they seem and that goes double for time when you the one engaging. at the very least it will definately give you a greater respect for boxers who condition themselves to get punched in the head for 36 minutes straight...lol
good post jack.
Thanks.
Actually, boxing is child's play compared to what these dogs do.
First of all, even world title fights are not 36 min straight. The boxers get 11 one-minute breaks, every 3 min, to regroup, catch their breath, rinse their mouths, get their cuts tended to, etc.
Secondly, there are rules of what kind of punishment a boxer can take and what he doesn't have to be subjected to.
Finally, none of the boxers is really out there to kill each other; they're out there to outpoint, or possibly KO, each other with padded gloves on.
A boxer does NOT have to get his ass rooted in the corner, turned upside down, with a mofo SERIOUSLY TRYING TO KILL HIM FOR REAL IN THE THROAT ... with DEATH as the INTENDED outcome.
A boxer does NOT get rooted in the kidneys, or have his guts pulled out, or have 4 teeth crushed out of his broken face/muzzle/jawbone ... or have to run scratches on a compound fracture ... or with 1/4 his blood supply leaked-out of a bleeder. (Or all of the above ...)
Boxing is actually a joke compared to what these dogs go through, there's a referee to protect boxers from "rough stuff" ... while there is nothing protecting these dogs ... and they get no breaks.
Maybe I woke up on the wrong side of the bed today, but it just pisses me off when some wiseguy, who has NO CONCEPT of what it's like to be in a TRULY brutal, life-and-death fight, "scoffs at" the idea that gameness can be displayed in 18 minutes of pure hell, pure lethal brutality, with truly lethal intentions.
What these dogs sometimes have to go through is no fucking joke ... and it is nothing to be scoffed at ... especially by someone who's truly never been down that road themselves. Period. :idea:
Jack
wolverine
12-22-2014, 07:17 PM
And on another note I give props to anybody that actually posts a loss. It's kina funny how many peds show those W's, but somehow are lacking those L's.
dpitbull
12-23-2014, 06:42 AM
People who say things like this typically have never really been in a fight themselves. They have no concept of anything.
18 min = 6 rounds of boxing (without getting five 1-min breaks inbetween).
Now then, you take a stopwatch, and you actually sit there and *time* 18 minutes ... just sit there for 18 minutes :idea:
Now, while you're sitting on your ass for 18 minutes straight, imagine instead GETTING YOUR FUCKING ASS HANDED TO YOU EVERY SECOND OF IT.
Kicked, punched, stomped, dominated, fucked up, thrown, slammed, bit, elbowed, NO RULES, you are getting fucking POUNDED. Just DECIMATED ... until you are ABOUT TO DIE.
You sit there and really think about taking 18 straight minutes of absolute abuse, to the point where you're about to die, and if you had enough mettle in you to "scratch back" to that ...
I doubt that very much. My bet would be you would shit all over yourself, beg for mercy, and would *not* willingly go back "for more" of that type of total abuse to the point of death.
Actually go through something like that first, and until you do, don't ever again and ask "How a dog can be so damned game" in :18 of time, if it really was on the brink of death.
See if some part of that empty space between your ears can register what it might be like to get the living shit knocked out of you for that long, by a truly devastating opponent, before you EVER try to sit there again (all high and mighty) judging the gameness of an animal that is 100x gamer than you :idea:
Jack
:appl:
CRISIS
12-23-2014, 09:34 AM
Thanks.
Actually, boxing is child's play compared to what these dogs do.
First of all, even world title fights are not 36 min straight. The boxers get 11 one-minute breaks, every 3 min, to regroup, catch their breath, rinse their mouths, get their cuts tended to, etc.
Secondly, there are rules of what kind of punishment a boxer can take and what he doesn't have to be subjected to.
Finally, none of the boxers is really out there to kill each other; they're out there to outpoint, or possibly KO, each other with padded gloves on.
A boxer does NOT have to get his ass rooted in the corner, turned upside down, with a mofo SERIOUSLY TRYING TO KILL HIM FOR REAL IN THE THROAT ... with DEATH as the INTENDED outcome.
A boxer does NOT get rooted in the kidneys, or have his guts pulled out, or have 4 teeth crushed out of his broken face/muzzle/jawbone ... or have to run scratches on a compound fracture ... or with 1/4 his blood supply leaked-out of a bleeder. (Or all of the above ...)
Boxing is actually a joke compared to what these dogs go through, there's a referee to protect boxers from "rough stuff" ... while there is nothing protecting these dogs ... and they get no breaks.
Maybe I woke up on the wrong side of the bed today, but it just pisses me off when some wiseguy, who has NO CONCEPT of what it's like to be in a TRULY brutal, life-and-death fight, "scoffs at" the idea that gameness can be displayed in 18 minutes of pure hell, pure lethal brutality, with truly lethal intentions.
What these dogs sometimes have to go through is no fucking joke ... and it is nothing to be scoffed at ... especially by someone who's truly never been down that road themselves. Period. :idea:
Jack
I agree.... I was more so looking at it as the time comparison, how 8 minutes can seem like a half hour... I agree that not too many (if any) men can go out & endure what these dogs do.
Officially Retired
12-23-2014, 09:55 AM
I agree.... I was more so looking at it as the time comparison, how 8 minutes can seem like a half hour... I agree that not too many (if any) men can go out & endure what these dogs do.
Agreed. And, more importantly, sometimes more true mayhem, decimation, and trauma can be wrought in an :18 bloodbath than in a 2-hr dance.
As boxing legend Jack Denpsey once said, "I can respect a man who only lasts 60 wild seconds with me more than a guy I have to chase around the ring for 15 rounds."
At the end of the day we must take stock of what is actually happening in there, rather than look at our watches.
And it also helps to have some actual fighting experience ourselves ti draw from.
Jack
Punishem601
12-25-2014, 06:16 AM
Jack, fuck that shit u talking, I'll beat your ass for an 1hr str8 don't ever in your mf life try to insult me on this bullshit ass board for asking a person what they think about being game in 18-22 min. U must be one of the same mf with them bullshit ass hounds,yeah that was probably your main fucking sell pitch, you gotta e a stupid mf to call a dog game in 18 min. Pound for pound if a dog has to show gameness that fast he had no business in there. So take this shit how u wanna take it, but I don't give a shit about some ex ass puppy peddler opinion.
Officially Retired
12-25-2014, 08:22 AM
Jack, fuck that shit u talking, I'll beat your ass for an 1hr str8 don't ever in your mf life try to insult me on this bullshit ass board for asking a person what they think about being game in 18-22 min.
Sorry, dumbass, you don't have the skills to do that.
U must be one of the same mf with them bullshit ass hounds,yeah that was probably your main fucking sell pitch, you gotta e a stupid mf to call a dog game in 18 min.
Again, dumbass, I don't have "hounds," I have bulldogs.
And my bulldogs have beaten, as well as proven their gameness against, the best dogs and dogmen to be had in the sport.
Meanwhile, you and yours haven't done shit.
You're a stupid MF by virtue or a lot of things ... and I don't have time this morning to roll-out the list.
Pound for pound if a dog has to show gameness that fast he had no business in there.
We agree on this, but the subject was gameness, not ability.
Clearly, IF a dog showed extreme gameness by 18, then he was in way over his head. Very bright of you to figure this one out with no help :rolleyes:
But that wasn't the subject, genius, the subject was gameness. And the answer is YES, a dog "can" be picked up "game" (still willing) in :18.
And if you were so smart, and had your head anywhere besides up your ass, you could have figured this out for yourself too :idea:
So take this shit how u wanna take it, but I don't give a shit about some ex ass puppy peddler opinion.
I took it for exactly what it was: the ape-like babbling of a money without a brain ... so long retard :bootintheass:
And Merry Christmas :lol:
Jack
Officially Retired
12-25-2014, 08:50 AM
My guess, buddy, is you've never actually been in a real fight.
A serious fight. A fight where somebody really did have better skills than you, and whooped your ass for a long time.
And, trust me, you'd think 18 straight minutes of getting your ass handed to you, the point of needing to have your life saved, would seem "a long time" ...
It does take gameness to stay in there with someone like that, under conditions like that, and the fact you "don't know this" means you have no experience fighting truly skilled opponents.
You're a dumbass thug with dogs, nothing more.
And before you call me "just a peddler," realize the dogs I produce have been able to beat the best in the world (for many, many years now) ... while you're still "buying dogs" and trying to figure out what "this and that" means ...
So don't ever question what I say, until thousands of people all over the world start paying you $100, just to be able to read "your" opinions on the subject of dogs ... and we both know that day will never come :idea:
Jack
Punishem601
12-25-2014, 01:16 PM
Fuck you and them sorry ass washed up ass hounds you had. All you own us a fucking house dog you peace of shit hair raising tail tucking ass mf cur just like the hounds you had. What was in the past ain't shit what do u have now for hunting? Like I said once before you fucking punk you couldn't whoop me if I had the flu and your hounds couldn't hunt with mine if they all was starved and fucking dehydrated .so fuck you and your opinions and if both of your fucking legs aren't broke muzzle isn't tore to shreds then in 18 then there is no way that mf is game so fuck you and all of the shit that you have claimed to have done!!!!!! By the way u have a merry Christmas you dick sucker.......
Punishem601
12-25-2014, 01:20 PM
By the way picking up that fast is just saving yourself from embarrassment. I'm glad I don't have none of that bullshit in none of my peds.....
Punishem601
12-25-2014, 01:25 PM
You see my handle come this way and win consistently
Punishem601
12-25-2014, 01:45 PM
By the way I don't have to fight i ain't a fucking dog glocks and choppers and shit do it for me!!!!!
Officially Retired
12-25-2014, 02:02 PM
I am on my phone now, and don't have the time or inclination to hammer out a long decimation of your silly rants. Yeah, okay, you and your sick dogs are the toughest ever :rolleyes:
Clown, you are clearly the dumbass thug I pegged you for.
We both know your dogs have never beaten, nor produced, a top shelf Champion. Ever.
And we both you hide behind a gun because you sense something about yourself, deep down, that you want to protect from being revealed.
Jack
MISTER
12-25-2014, 02:06 PM
Fuck you and them sorry ass washed up ass hounds you had. All you own us a fucking house dog you peace of shit hair raising tail tucking ass mf cur just like the hounds you had. What was in the past ain't shit what do u have now for hunting? Like I said once before you fucking punk you couldn't whoop me if I had the flu and your hounds couldn't hunt with mine if they all was starved and fucking dehydrated .so fuck you and your opinions and if both of your fucking legs aren't broke muzzle isn't tore to shreds then in 18 then there is no way that mf is game so fuck you and all of the shit that you have claimed to have done!!!!!! By the way u have a merry Christmas you dick sucker.......
I run vise grip dogs and few of my associates, if they're ”washed up” I'm your huckleberry. Anytime I'll oblige I'm sick of all you cocksuckers popping off bout a line of dogs. For the record I happen to own a vise grip cross that I believe is far superior to anything you feed.
Another thing stop popping that gun shit, put your fists up like a man. Sick of all these pussies (yourself included) screaming I'll grab a glock or chopper. Take your asswhipping like a man.
Black Hand
12-25-2014, 04:25 PM
This guy is having a hard time differentiating being picked up game and being game. A cur dog can be picked up game if he is still willingly to continue. It happens all the time, hence dogs who didn't quit their first time out but did their second... or a dog like rascal who quit his first time out but not the next handful of matches. It's not rocket science.
Punishem601
12-25-2014, 05:38 PM
Ok mister, let your mouth wright checks that ya ass can't cash, hit me up and let's get it 662-312-1694 punish you!!!!! Vise grip ain't shit kill them now and save time and money....
Punishem601
12-25-2014, 05:40 PM
Hey mister fuck you to nigga you ain't shit but a cali jack dick sucker!!!!!!!
Officially Retired
12-25-2014, 06:01 PM
Ok mister, let your mouth wright checks that ya ass can't cash, hit me up and let's get it 662-312-1694 punish you!!!!! Vise grip ain't shit kill them now and save time and money....
The word is write, idiot, not wright ... and you are too primitive to be here, so you're gone.
Jack
FrostyPaws
12-25-2014, 07:24 PM
Ok mister, let your mouth wright checks that ya ass can't cash, hit me up and let's get it 662-312-1694 punish you!!!!! Vise grip ain't shit kill them now and save time and money....
You are an embarrassment to the state of Mississippi. I never met any legit dogman from Mississippi that ever conducted himself in such a sorry, disrespectful manner.
Sometimes you gotta take the trash out, even on Christmas.
Officially Retired
12-25-2014, 08:12 PM
Ho ho ho :lol::rolleyes:
So if a dog happens to have a real bad bleeder within the first 18 mins. An you pick up to save him. An on his courtesy scratch he goes an takes hold. I would believe the owner can call him 1xgl. Does anyone agree
Yes, simply due the fact he didn't stop. But it doesn't mean shit. I had a dog that didn't perform his scratch in 2:50. I believe he was a very game dog.
I was trying to help Punishem601 to understand what every one saying in a easy way so he could understand, but Now I see I was to late. Looks like he has a BOOT print on his ASS now.
FrostyPaws
12-26-2014, 07:54 AM
So if a dog happens to have a real bad bleeder within the first 18 mins. An you pick up to save him. An on his courtesy scratch he goes an takes hold. I would believe the owner can call him 1xgl. Does anyone agree
I don't agree.
I don't agree.
Would you like to add why
FrostyPaws
12-26-2014, 10:54 AM
Because with a bad bleeder, there is a loss of blood. And if I go strictly by what you wrote, it is simply a quick loss of blood that you're worried with, and that doesn't entail gameness in my thought process. That tells me an artery was hit, which is pretty common, and you did the thing you thought best, but it doesn't make me think the dog showed what I consider to be game.
Officially Retired
12-26-2014, 12:34 PM
Because with a bad bleeder, there is a loss of blood. And if I go strictly by what you wrote, it is simply a quick loss of blood that you're worried with, and that doesn't entail gameness in my thought process. That tells me an artery was hit, which is pretty common, and you did the thing you thought best, but it doesn't make me think the dog showed what I consider to be game.
We agree, except that there is a difference between "what you" consider to be (I assume, proven-) game ... and a dog merely being picked up "game" (as in "still willing" at the point of pick up).
Ultimately, the term "proven game" is a subjective assessment on any dog that is picked up.
Ultimately, there is room for error in trying to make any kind of "permanent" assessment of a living animal :idea:
Too many future variables are possible, and so to try to make any kind of extreme permanent assessment, based on a past performance, is ultimately absurd.
Therefore, we can only speak with authority on the past performance, and we can only do so based on facts.
A dog "having run a scratch," and making contact after pick-up, is an objective fact that the dog was still willing to scratch at the point of pick-up, on that contest.
It doesn't mean the dog is "permanently game" ... there simply is no way to determine such a thing, based on a past performance, regardless of what time or what was done :idea:
It only means the dog didn't just stand there, he went over, and in doing so expressed willingness to continue at the point of pickup.
Jack
> EDITED
FrostyPaws
12-26-2014, 04:14 PM
We agree, except that there is a difference between "what you" consider to be (I assume, proven-) game ... and a dog merely being picked up "game" (as in "still willing" at the point of pick up).
Ultimately, the term "proven game" is a subjective assessment on any dog that is picked up.
Ultimately, there is room for error in trying to make any kind of "permanent" assessment of a living animal :idea:
Too many future variables are possible, and so to try to make any kind of extreme permanent assessment, based on a past performance, is ultimately absurd.
Therefore, we can only speak with authority on the past performance, and we can only do so based on facts.
A dog "having run a scratch," and making contact after pick-up, is an objective fact that the dog was still willing to scratch at the point of pick-up, on that contest.
It doesn't mean the dog is "permanently game" ... there simply is no way to determine such a thing, based on a past performance, regardless of what time or what was done :idea:
It only means the dog didn't just stand there, he went over, and in doing so expressed willingness to continue at the point of pickup.
Jack
> EDITED
When I use the word “game” I'm not using the literal meaning of the word. If that's the case, then picking a dog up in 10 minutes without anything wrong with it physically is picked up game. And that would be simply because it scratched over.
If I'm to look at it that way, then every dog I've ever picked up during schooling, that didn't quit, was picked up game. No. Not at my house, literal meaning or not. Being game means more, TO ME, than the simply willingness to continue at any juncture.
Officially Retired
12-26-2014, 04:20 PM
When I use the word “game” I'm not using the literal meaning of the word. If that's the case, then picking a dog up in 10 minutes without anything wrong with it physically is picked up game. And that would be simply because it scratched over.
If I'm to look at it that way, then every dog I've ever picked up during schooling, that didn't quit, was picked up game. No. Not at my house, literal meaning or not. Being game means more, TO ME, than the simply willingness to continue at any juncture.
Again, I believe two things are being confused: 1) the mindset of the dog "at the time he was picked up," versus 2) the permanent state of the dog "being game," for sure.
You are trying to attribute #2 in the place of #1.
The statement "a dog was picked up game" is not #2; it relates to #1.
He was picked up and was still willing to go at that time ... it does not mean (and never was intended to mean) "the dog is a for-sure-game animal, under any circumstance."
It was merely picked up at X time, still wanting to go, in this contest.
Jack
FrostyPaws
12-26-2014, 04:34 PM
It was merely picked up at X time, still wanting to go, in this contest.
Jack
And that is about how I would look at it, and word it, right there. I wouldn't stick the word "game" in there as I simply save that for dogs that fit what I define as game for my own yard. I don't have a separation of the two.
Officially Retired
12-26-2014, 04:43 PM
And that is about how I would look at it, and word it, right there. I wouldn't stick the word "game" in there as I simply save that for dogs that fit what I define as game for my own yard. I don't have a separation of the two.
Well, in contests, it is often asked, "Was he willing to continue?"
And you must answer yes or no.
The no answer means the dog quit.
The yes answer means the dog lost, but was still game (willing to continue) at the time of stoppage.
Neither one is a permanent statement.
A dog can quit in one contest ... and then win 8x more and never show a sign of quitting (like Crenshaw's Ch Rascal) ...
And a dog can show game in one contest (be willing after some severe trauma) ... but then quit his next time out.
In the end ... you just never know what's going to happen on "the next one" ... and NO man's "assessment" is ever 100% :idea:
I think most of us, with some time under our belts, can analyze the surrounding factors and decide if there was enough adversity to take our hat off to the dog ... or not put too much stock in what happened.
Jack
Donnybrook
12-26-2014, 07:01 PM
Friend once old me its all about quality not quantity. Minutes are not as important as the quality of the roll. Gameness is all about that one persons opinion.
Officially Retired
12-27-2014, 05:29 AM
Friend once old me its all about quality not quantity. Minutes are not as important as the quality of the roll.
Well said.
Gameness is all about that one persons opinion.
Have to disagree with this.
Gameness is all about the willingness to go back and keep fighting, which is factually-expressed by the effort to do so ...
The only "opinions" that come into play have to do about speculation into the future, but whether or not a dog made is scratch is an objective fact, measured in time (10 seconds).
Jack
Obvious people have different ideas about the term game. The definition is not really important. Just be honest to yourself, cause you know best whether the dog made a good courtesy according circumstances. The term LG imo just means the dog didnt stop technically that day.
The term game is used to loosely....most who use the term have no understanding of what the true meaning is.
Willing to cross that line (continue) means just that, it does not necessarily mean that particular animal is game. A bulldog can scratch (continue) and still be a cur.
In saying that I'm not suggesting to the blowhards that you must "skull drag" to determine what gameness means. I believe this subject has always been a slippery slope. And dogs either suffer or lack being properly evaluated because of what someone else writes on a board or says out loud.
It can be equated to the talent of a truly good athlete. If you are truly good athletically it is either born to you or you are intelligent enough to gain those skills and use them to your advantage.
There are lots of excellent posts here with the exception of P601's, who simply stumbled into the wrong dogyard!
S_B
YELLOWJOHN
12-27-2014, 09:11 AM
gameness to me is willing to continue with life ending no return results.... and someone with common sense was smart enough to pick up or made a choice before it was to late to pick up sometimes this is not so common as some cant swallow there pride.... as for time that doesn't determine gameness as some would assume ...
Officially Retired
12-27-2014, 09:27 AM
I still think there is an ongoing confusion between the FACT a dog was "picked up game" (meaning, still willing to go at the time of pick up) ... and the idea of a dog being game ... "permanently" ... under "any" circumstance.
I personally believe the latter to be of dubious likelihood.
I can think of several dogs that I can't imagine quitting, ever, under MOST fighting circumstances ... however, I also can't think of ANY dog that I couldn't "make" quit IF I wanted to stack the odds far enough against them.
Would Ozzie's Homer have scratched into Jeep ... if he had an intestinal blockage for 2 days, was septic with pus pockets in his teeth/jawbone, and was 9 years old when the contest began ... I doubt it, but who knows?
In other words, we have to picture and use normal circumstances in our judgement. We can only go on FACTS and "our gut" ... and how many game dogs we're able to come up with, over time, tends to validate (or impune) our abilities to assess what we're looking at.
Jack
PS: Always remember that many dogs that "show game" against one level of dog, all of a sudden don't show quite so game when they face another level of dog ...
bolero
12-28-2014, 03:00 AM
picked up game literally means nothing unless u were there to witness all the factors
Officially Retired
12-28-2014, 05:26 AM
picked up game literally means nothing unless u were there to witness all the factors
So what you're saying is that, every contest in the history of the game, that "you" weren't a direct witness to, "means nothing" ???
Jeep/Homer, Buck/Sandman, etc. all "mean nothing" because "you" did not personally give "your" final stamp of approval :question:
Kind of an egomaniac, eh :rolleyes:
If a dog is 'picked up' and is 'willing to continue' he has been picked up game. If, at that point in time, he is willing to continue he has been 'picked up game'. If the next day, next week, next month, next year he decides he is no longer willing, then at that point he is a cur.
"picked up game' (still willing) is not saying 'forever game' or 'dead game' or 'pit game' or 'deep game' or any other of the descriptive terms that sway the perception of what 'game' is. Even if one is from the school of no descriptive terms, it is 'game' or 'not game', with no varying degrees, being picked up while still willing is still game. EWO
DeezNutz
11-09-2018, 03:13 AM
If you don't understand, then I can't explain it any clearer.
Yes, in addition to many other things I've had to explain to you.
You're confused again. So I will explain again.
A dog CAN be picked up "game" ... willing to continue. (Happens all the time.)
What you're saying is some people MISTAKE (or misrepresent) a "game" pick up, where a dog is not willing to continue, but the owner tries to pass it off as a game pickup.
Yes, Nut, we all know that some people might misrepresent what happened, but that is a whole other issue isn't it? :-w
For that matter, some people misrepresent pedigrees too, but that doesn't mean ALL dogs aren't really papered the way the breeder says, does it?
In the same fashion, so what, some people "say" their dog was willing to continue, when it wasn't, but that doesn't mean ALL dogs aren't willing to continue when picked up, because quite a few are.
So, again, YES, a dog CAN be picked up "game" (willing to continue), but that doesn't necessarily mean the dog wouldn't quit later on.
It only means it was picked up, and still was clearly willing to go, at the time it was picked up, nothing more, nothing less.
Please refer to my original post where trying to infer "absolute gameness" is a folly unto itself.
Thanks,
Jack
LOL