View Full Version : Looking for a different kibble.
BLADE
03-29-2019, 08:28 AM
Do any of you have any recommendations on a kibble worth feeding? I'm feeding Victor 24/20 and have been for several years with the exception of the times I went RAW. I'm just not happy with Victor anymore. They have gotten like every other feed company in my opinion when it comes to pricing themselves right out of the hunting dog market. I've also noticed numerous dogs wanting to eat dirt and grass for the past year. I'm not the only one either, a good friend of mine has been seeing his coon dogs doing the same thing on Victor. I think something is out of balance with the feed or it's lacking something. What are y'all feeding that you feel is a good feed for the money and your dogs do well on it?
sam i am
03-29-2019, 11:06 AM
When I feed kibble, wellness was my go to. Hardly no recalls if any. Hard stool great skin and coat,didn’t require much to maintain weight. Just the regular chicken formula in the purple bag.
BLADE
03-29-2019, 01:56 PM
It looks good but it is priced at $55 for 30pounds here. I'd be money ahead to go RAW. Thanks for the reply.
LivewireT
03-29-2019, 09:36 PM
currently feeding sportmix and I change formulas with the seasons get it delivered by chewy.com just ordered 3 40 lb bags of the wholesomes fish formula for show season 91.00 shipped to my door not a bad deal as always chicken is in their diet when I can find it cheap
BLADE
03-30-2019, 04:32 AM
https://www.diamondpet.com/our-brands/diamond-naturals/extreme-athlete-adult-dog-chicken-rice-formula/
I haven't fed any Diamond feed in years but after looking at this particular model, it scores a perfect five star rating on the dog food advisor page. My 24/20 high energy Victor only scores a 3.5 star rating. I also priced this model of Diamond at my feed store and it will cost me 5 cents a pound more than what I'm currently paying for Victor. I'm gonna give it a go and see if the dirt and grass eating stops. Thanks for the replies guys.
apeman
04-01-2019, 06:03 AM
Fromm has worked well for me.
Game Scratch Kennels
04-02-2019, 05:42 AM
The Victor hi-pro plus is a good kibble. 30/20. And CanineX by sports mix is a good kibble. It's grain free and it's 32/25
BONEDADDY
06-21-2019, 06:07 AM
I was mixing Diamond Naturals with Victor and then with Canine X beef. I think that I am going to stick with Diamond Naturals Chicken and Rice formula. Small amount of stools and dogs look great on it. I also have a couple of days where I feed chicken quarters (mostly on rainy days). Victor just doesn't seem to do the same thing for my dogs as they did in the past. Tried a raw diet but my work schedule (12-hour days) doesn't allow for the proper prep time.
BLADE
06-21-2019, 11:21 AM
I tried the Diamond naturals extreme athlete chicken and rice formula for for about a month. I wasn't happy with the stools. Some were fine but others just kept shitty mush piles and it stinks up the yard. I agree with you BONEDADDY, the Victor isn't the same feed as it use to be. From what I can find, Victor started using a cheaper protein source in the form of blood mill. Blood mill is used as a plant fertilizer but from what I've seen it's not popular to use in a dog food. Anyway it's something to consider when you realize Victor feed has changed from what it use to be.
https://www.pminutrition.com/products/detail/adult-dog-chicken-brown-rice-exclusive/
I've been feeding this feed for a month or so and it is so far everything I'm looking for in a kibble. It's pricy and can only be bought at feed stores and co-op type stores like Victor but if you have access to it then I'd recommend giving it a try. PMI offers a deal to where for every 8 bags you buy, you get the ninth bag Free! I pay $36.32 per #35 bag which is more than Victor or Diamond but I'm getting better results and I don't have to feed as much because it tends to hold my dogs weight better.
I use Buddy Boy 24/20. It keeps the dogs up, good stool and such.
I add a lot of chicken to their diet so the 'keeps them up' is aided quite a bit. It is seldom the dog food alone, it is the additives that can make a cheaper bag food more effective.
The Buddy Boy is $22.50/50lbs here in NC.
I have never checked reviews so I ma not sure what they would say. I would think at $0.45 a pound it falls into the flavored cardboard category.
I fed Buddy Boy many years ago and was well satisfied but the distributor moved to a new brand. I jumped brand to brand trying to feed a lot of dogs for as less money as possible, and still 'keep the dogs up'.
I could never get a solid stool with the Diamond brands, and there was Nutrena brand here that was the same. There was a brand called Chestnut Mountain and it worked very well and was even cheaper, but in rural areas you are at the mercy of what the guy who buys it by the truckload and re-sells. His flavor has to be your flavor or the search continues.
Black Gold was one I liked but I had to drive about an hour or so to get a pallet. It got to be more that I wanted to deal with at the time, but the dogs did well on it.
EWO
Osagedogman2015
06-22-2019, 08:01 AM
What I do is similar to what EWO is doing.
I buy a local feed that is 24/20 that has no corn or soy, and it is right at $23/50#. I rotate feeding chicken quarters, liver (deer,beef,chicken),deer heart, scraps every other day or so. The kibble is used as a base feed. I've tried/fed raw for periods of time, but I can never seem to hold it together consistently for long periods of time.
I fill the freezers every year with wild game, so any scraps or internal organs are always saved and processed so that I can add some to their feed throughout the year. A little bit goes a long ways, no need to over do it with that stuff. They are used as supplements. When I run out of the wild game scraps, I buy those kind of things at the supermarket.
I also feed lots of eggs to my dogs. I raise a lot of chickens so there are always plenty to go around. I try to give them one egg every other day.
Agreed, We must be drinking from the same vein of water.
Our plan is almost identical. This past deer season was my weakest ever. I have been out of deer meat since very early in the spring. So it has been all about grabbing things when they are on sale.
I too have tried going all raw but it always came down to the amount of time it takes to prep the meals. I once rented a house from a butcher who also ran a small processing business at home. I got a five gallon bucket of any and everything just about every day. I walked by the dogs and whatever came out of the bucket is what they got, no rhyme nor reason.
I use the bag food as a staple and then use the raw food as a supplement. Like today, I walked by and dropped leg quarters in each dog bowl. That is all they got today. Tomorrow they will get the dog food and I too have a lot of chickens, and the dogs will get a couple of eggs dropped in the bowl too.
If it is a dog that is about to do hard work I start lessening the amount of the dry food and upping the raw content, especially the fat. I do that about 8-10 weeks prior to starting hard work to give the dog time to acclimate to the upgrade in food.
I basically feed cheap dry dog food and supplement it to make it a healthier version. I trade a little bit of quality for a lot of convenience.
EWO
BLADE
06-23-2019, 07:39 AM
I've heard it said and read many times that for a dog to digest raw vs kibble, they digest at different rates. Now common sense tells me that it apparently doesn't make much difference because many conditioners have fed a raw /kibble blend with great accomplishments. My question would be.. does it shock a dogs digestive system to flip flop whole meals like all kibble one day and all raw the next?
Osagedogman2015
06-23-2019, 09:08 AM
My observation is this, and it doesn't mean that I am not missing something. It is what I believe to be true based on direct observation and hands on experience.
As long as the dogs are familiar with being fed kibble and raw food, and are being fed different things within this feeding method, then going from kibble one day and then to raw chicken the next day shouldn't/doesn't shock their system at all. The same goes for mixing the two together daily. Of course, i would not vary the diet from day to day on a dog that I was working for obvious reasons, but for a dog that was simply being maintained or kept healthy, I don't see any issues at all. I think anytime that you can give them raw chicken, beef, liver, fat, etc....that it is a good thing.
Dogs can eat some of the nastiest stuff and thrive on it. Their system is very strong. And to me, Bulldogs are some of the best animals to see results and feedback on what you are doing to them, whether it is exercise and/or feeding methods.
BLADE
06-23-2019, 10:28 AM
My observation is this, and it doesn't mean that I am not missing something. It is what I believe to be true based on direct observation and hands on experience.
As long as the dogs are familiar with being fed kibble and raw food, and are being fed different things within this feeding method, then going from kibble one day and then to raw chicken the next day shouldn't/doesn't shock their system at all. The same goes for mixing the two together daily. Of course, i would not vary the diet from day to day on a dog that I was working for obvious reasons, but for a dog that was simply being maintained or kept healthy, I don't see any issues at all. I think anytime that you can give them raw chicken, beef, liver, fat, etc....that it is a good thing.
Dogs can eat some of the nastiest stuff and thrive on it. Their system is very strong. And to me, Bulldogs are some of the best animals to see results and feedback on what you are doing to them, whether it is exercise and/or feeding methods.
You make a lot of good points that I can personally attest to seeing with my two eyes as well. I've fed many ways.. raw, kibble, raw with kibble while working etc. I haven't ever tried the one day raw next day kibble approach as far as maintenance feeding goes but glad you gave some feedback on the subject. I have a couple other friends that feed like that and prefer it over just feeding kibble everyday.
The kicker is everything a dog eats digests at different rates. Even different dry foods, based on their composition, will digest at different rates. The very first few times a dog is fed raw one day and dry the next there will be some loose stool, not every dog but a lot of them.
Complete changes should be done gradually but I have not seen it as being the end of the world when I do it. I feed mostly kibble but supplement with raw parts regularly. And some days it is a bowl fool of raw with no kibble. I have not seen any negative effects from the switching/combinations.
Like was posted before, the feed plan gets a lot more detailed when the hard work starts.
EWO
ceasar
06-27-2019, 12:46 PM
like the extreme athlete in the winter or working but not as a maintenance feed. All pups started on taste of the wild then switched over to valu pak at a year old with whatever meat on sale. Here I get the valu pak 50lbs for $25. Dogs look good, stools are solid and manageable without the awful mell with diamond.
Good post.
I agree. The maintenance plan for me is just good enough to keep them within striking distance of a keep feed.
When the weather breaks there is an upgrade and when the work is ready to start there is an upgrade.
Then back.
EWO
Coach
11-05-2019, 12:47 PM
Value Pak is a great kibble for the price and quality.
As good or better than Victor and cheaper
brokeback
11-05-2019, 01:26 PM
I'm with Coach. I feed Valu Pak now and am happy with it. Black bag. 50lbs for 25.95 plus tax. I fed Victor for years but their constant price hikes got old. It was no longer worth what they were charging to feed a decent size yard. Valu Pak black bag has no corn and has the dogs looking good with minimal waste to clean up.
APBT4LIFE
11-05-2019, 02:27 PM
I am feeding a 50/50 mix of Black Gold Original and Purina Pro Plan Sport
ceasar
11-05-2019, 05:33 PM
Gotta agree with the valu pak black bag. $25 for #50 and the dogs look and act great. Coats shine like new money and no crazy stools. The guy I get it from runs ch. coon hounds and the food really seems to work well for him.
brasso
11-06-2019, 01:00 AM
Purina. They've been around forever and with no major issues. I don't understand why people fuck around with anything else. Victor's new formula is a joke. These over-priced "grain free" foods are garbage too, that will ultimately hurt your dogs. I don't know... 30yrs ago Hi Pro was just fine and no dog died from it as far as I know. Now all of the sudden it's gotta be corn free, gluten free, this free and that free. I mean wtf?! I wonder what Colby fed Pincher...
brokeback
11-06-2019, 05:50 AM
Are you a Purina salesman? LOL. I mean, who gives a shit what anybody else feeds. If you're happy with Purina then by all means keep feeding it. Nobody is trying to talk you out of it lol.
Coach
11-06-2019, 06:19 AM
Purina. They've been around forever and with no major issues. I don't understand why people fuck around with anything else. Victor's new formula is a joke. These over-priced "grain free" foods are garbage too, that will ultimately hurt your dogs. I don't know... 30yrs ago Hi Pro was just fine and no dog died from it as far as I know. Now all of the sudden it's gotta be corn free, gluten free, this free and that free. I mean wtf?! I wonder what Colby fed Pincher...
I wonder what Colby WOULDA fed had he had more options?
Coach
11-06-2019, 06:24 AM
I'm nobody, but like many here, I have over 25 years of feeding a yard averaging probably 20 dogs per year. Valu Pak is as good or bettter a maintenance feed as there is on the market. I feed the silver bag for daily use. It's better than any single Purina product I've ever used.
Brasso - with your logic, why not just really save and feed your dogs corn?
brasso
11-06-2019, 06:57 AM
Simply trying to make a point that we tend to overthink today's many options and there is no right answer. I didn't realize this is such a sensitive topic for some.
Sorry to have offended you ladies.
BRICKFACE
11-06-2019, 09:10 AM
I've been feeding victor for about 5 years now. Shit I pay $90 for a 50# bag. I need to tell the owner of the store about valu pak or open my own store. These prices are crazy
brasso
11-06-2019, 09:18 AM
@brickface Have you noticed a change in Victor since the new formula? The Victor Pro is about $51 for 50lbs on Chewy.
https://www.chewy.com/victor-professional-formula-dry-dog/dp/120686
About forty years ago the guy that turned me onto the dogs fed Field Trial. Looking back it was just about flavored card board. It still had a feather or two in it. We filled two five gallon buckets about 1/2 to 3/4 full or so, then filled with water. Within no time it would swell and turn to a mush, the texture of cheap canned food.
It was forty plus dogs there. Bulldogs, beagles, coon dogs and bird dogs and one big ass Doberman that ran loose on the yard.
On that incredibly cheap shit the dogs did really well. He tree'd coons, jumped rabbits and won matches with the best of them.
The dog is a natural scavenger and will survive on just about anything. The object is to slide off the 'survive' line and ease toward the 'thrive' line.
I knew an older guy that worked in a chicken house. When they 'candled' the eggs any that were not fertile were thrown out. He came home with a five gallon bucket or more of eggs everyday. His routine was the same nearly every day. He fired up a huge pot and boiled the eggs, shell and all. When it cooled he mixed in a bag of powdered goats milk and on occasion a bucket of the cheapest dog food he could find, mostly right off the grocery store shelf.
He won a bunch of matches over the years but around here he was known best for his hunting dogs. His dogs simply put meat in the freezer.
I would think a diet of 90% eggs would be detrimental but it worked for him, and his dogs.
EWO
brasso
11-06-2019, 02:11 PM
Nice writeup, EWO. I think the major problem is that most of us have fallen prey to the dog food manufacturers' marketing. We try to do the best we can for our best friends and they certainly know how to capitalize on our emotions. I actually remember Field Trial. Hard to forget, never seen anything like it. I worked at a boarding kennel in the late 80's and that was their basic kennel food. I guess everyone wants to know what's the best dog food... Sort of like asking what's the best bloodline. I only feed a couple and so cost to me is not a factor. However, if I was feeding many I would certainly try Valu Pak -although it's not available in the Pacific Northwest. Costco has their own basic maintenance brand. About 30 bucks for 50 lbs I think. I wouldn't hesitate to try that either.
brokeback
11-06-2019, 03:08 PM
I've fed dog feed with corn before the "corn free" fad ever came around, did the dogs survive on it? Yes.
I have also fed feed with corn since the corn free fad has been here and compared to ANY corn free feed the waste/clean up is most definitely noticeable. Feed with corn has stinky ass shit. No matter what brand I've tried, it stinks like hell and is a mess cleaning up. If the couple bucks a bag for corn filled feed works for you then by all means keep scooping that nasty shit. I prefer less waste and less stink. Shit is a pet peeve of mine. Can't stand nasty shit, so if being a corn free freak is bad then call me bad.
Brickface- those prices are absolutely ridiculous. I'd smack the feed store guy the next time you see him. He should at least give you a free tube of lube with those prices.
brasso
11-06-2019, 03:20 PM
Lmao brokeback! I'll never look at dog shit the same again.
Funny, I was going to say the same to Brickface.
brokeback
11-06-2019, 06:43 PM
It's true though, I hate nasty shit with a passion. And I always get it with feed with corn. Only downfall to the stuff IMO.
I feed my older stud dog and the puppies something different. Loyall Life by Nutrena. I get mine at TSC. $40 for 40lbs. Good feed.
BRICKFACE
11-06-2019, 06:53 PM
@brasso that Costco kibble is good stuff for the price.
Dang fellas extra lube lol. I feed the Victor Hero Canine $79 on chewy. I'm definitely gonna look at other options.
brokeback
11-06-2019, 08:42 PM
I didn't ask what formula you were feeding but I honestly didn't know any Victor was over 50 something. I was Victor's biggest fan for a long time but I'm off that wagon now and happy I am.
Down_on_the_bayou
11-08-2019, 10:55 AM
sportmix wholesomes works well for me.
ROCKET_BLAST
11-09-2019, 08:26 PM
Hurd valu-pak was a good feed.
We have our pup on Natural Balance Lamb and Brown Rice. I also give him a supplement called N'zymes sprinkled over his feed and these little bites from Zesty Paws that are supposed to be good for thier immune system.Hard little black turds,easy clean up.
SBCK
TrailerTrash
11-26-2019, 03:18 PM
I switched from TOTW to Purina Sport 30/20 and am really liking it .
BLADE
11-27-2019, 01:47 PM
The Exclusive red bag ( chicken & brown rice adult formula) is good feed. It's like Victor in that you can only buy it at mom & pop feed stores. The big chain stores can't sale it.
BRICKFACE
11-27-2019, 03:13 PM
I've been feeding Victor for a few years but recently switched to Fromm. It's a very high grade kibble with both quality and safety in mind. Everything in the bag is nutritious and healthy for your dogs. A little pricey but worth it IMO.
https://frommfamily.com/
BRICKFACE
11-27-2019, 03:17 PM
Looked into valu pak but with meat by-products I wouldnt put that into my dogs
I am also feeding the FROMM kibble and am happy with the results. It's been a good kibble for a long time, I fed it some years ago and recently went back to it. I never liked the trends of "grain free" and "high protein" in kibbles. Recent research has shown that grain free, especially those with a high pea content is causing heart problems in dogs. And high protein kibbles (over 30%) are not so healthy for the dogs and can lead to kidney issues.
I like to see some grain in a kibble, with a decent amount of meat. Not corn nor wheat nor sorghum, but rice or oats of some type. For most grown dogs 24% to about 28% protein in a dry food is fine. I also supplement with chicken thighs or quarters from the grocery store. And I add salmon oil and coconut oil, those are excellent for any dog.
The FROMM Puppy Gold is the kibble I feed now --
https://frommfamily.com/products/dog/gold/dry/#puppy-gold
It has 27% protein and 18% fat, with chicken, fish meal, oats, barley and rice in it. Even my dog with the more sensitive stomach does well on it. I like the ingredients a little better than the Adult version, but they are similar. Wish I could still get venison from hunters, but all my hunting friends are too old now and don't hunt. It's deer season now and that's some good eating for man and beast…