Vise Grip/Boyles

[wrongway]

Has anybody tried this cross? If so how did it work out and what strain of boyles did you use? And what made you do the cross?

[AL Clown]

Jack and Steel City both have bred the Vise-Grip blood with the Boyles blood. Jack owned a very good bitch by the name of (Tuffy) who was actually bred this way.

[Officially Retired]

Yes, Tuffy (http://www.apbt.online-pedigrees.com/public/printPedigree.php?dog_id=68956) was bred this way, though not by me but rather Mr. Nice Guy.

Tuffy's sire, Roy Jones Jr., was the straight cross, and he was supposed to be a very good dog, and his brother Ch Tank (http://www.apbt.online-pedigrees.com/public/printPedigree.php?dog_id=27657) was a 4xW.

Around the same time that Tuffy's sire Roy and Ch Tank were produced, another Boyles cross was made when LA Pit Crew bred his Daisy Duke bitch to Poncho, which produced Baller (http://www.apbt.online-pedigrees.com/public/printPedigree.php?dog_id=1037) 1xL 2:55. Even though he "lost" DG in 2:55, Baller should have been a Champion ... as he was a 43 that was matched into a 1xW @ 47 ... and with the size disparity it was like a rat and a mouse in there. Yet, despite the 4-lb weight advantage, the owner of the larger dog asked for a draw at 2:35 to try to save his dog. As if this wasn't bad enough, Baller's foolish owner had FED Baller right before the deal, and the reason Baller lost was he failed to complete his scratch at 2:55 ... but it wasn't a quit. Baller staggered to the other dog, stopped right in front of him, and then vomited-out black blood and a gutful of kibble, which took the last bit of steam out of him, causing him to collapse onto his side to be counted out. It is my opinion that, had Baller been owned by a top dogman, rather than a clueless greenhorn, he would have been Champion or better ... seeing as he decimated everything his weight ... and proved he was a rough,tough, long-distance machine too, by going 3 hours spotting 4 lb--and with a gut full of food to boot.

Another Boyles cross done at the time was the breeding that produced Tempest (http://www.apbt.online-pedigrees.com/public/printPedigree.php?dog_id=24033) that WWC did when he bred Diamond Girl to Tupper's Nevada. Tempest proved to be just an average bitch, and she actually got DOA'd in a roll. Her brother Bucky was a pretty wicked throat dog, who DOA'd 2 dogs also, but he actually got stretched out in :30 when he faced the other Poncho/Boyles cross Baller in a roll (and Baller was 2 lb lighter). Later, Bucky was matched into Desert Kennels, who brought a Hammonds dog, and Bucky stopped this dog in :50 to become a 1xW. Bucky and Tempest had another brother named Boyz-In-Tha-Hood's Warlock who was also a 1xW but who got stolen. They had another brother named Carson City, whom Tupper owned and was so impressed with he wrote into the Journal and said "Carson City is the best head dog he'd seen in the last 15 years." Before Tempest got killed, she was bred back to Poncho which produced Scarface's Big Boss ROM (http://www.apbt.online-pedigrees.com/public/printPedigree.php?dog_id=242093) and WWC's Brandy (http://www.apbt.online-pedigrees.com/public/printPedigree.php?dog_id=154346). Big Boss was sent to the Philippines and proved to be an average dog ... but he was a phenomenal producer ... producing such dogs as Blackflag Kennels Gr Ch Red (5xW, 2006 DOY) (http://www.apbt.online-pedigrees.com/public/printPedigree.php?dog_id=173130), Ch Aria (4xW, 1xL) (http://www.apbt.online-pedigrees.com/public/printPedigree.php?dog_id=253571), Ch Bitoy (3xW) (http://www.apbt.online-pedigrees.com/public/printPedigree.php?dog_id=261756), Guga (2xW, 2xBIS, 1xLDG) (http://www.apbt.online-pedigrees.com/public/printPedigree.php?dog_id=261991), and many other good dogs. Meanwhile, the sister Brandy was bred once as a puppy, and because she didn't start by 16 months of age her owners killed her. Meanwhile, out of that one breeding done with Brandy, to an Eli dog, she produced Murder Block's Gr Ch Tackelberry (6xW) (http://www.apbt.online-pedigrees.com/public/printPedigree.php?dog_id=226364).

There have been other Poncho/Boyles crosses that have been made that produced other Champions too, and there have been littermates to the dogs I've mentioned that have interesting stories also, but suffice it to say that the cross has been "average to exceptional" in every instance. I myself have only made this cross once, when I bred Screamer to Gr Ch Sparky to produce Pantera (http://www.apbt.online-pedigrees.com/public/printPedigree.php?dog_id=64226), who was a devastating and badass bitch, that likewise would have been a Champion (or better) IMO, but died to ownership incompetence ... being lost in a kennel wreck with Gee Had's Ch Mecca (4xW), who was 2 lb bigger than Pantera ... and that was after Pantera (who was locked in a shed) had spent all day chewing her way out of the shed to run into a 2-lb bigger ace gut dog. Gee Had found both dogs stretched out, Pantera dead, and Ch Mecca had to spend 2 weeks at the vet in order to be saved. It's a sad thing that happens to so many of these dogs ...

Jack


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[MinuteMan]

I always loved Pantera, there was just a look of PURE EVIL to that bitch!

Too bad she got wasted, I would have loved to see what she could produce. IMO her to Duke Nukem would have been a STELLER Poncho/screamer line breeding.

[Officially Retired]

I always loved Pantera, there was just a look of PURE EVIL to that bitch!
Too bad she got wasted, I would have loved to see what she could produce. IMO her to Duke Nukem would have been a STELLER Poncho/screamer line breeding.

Hi MM, nice to see you onboard & thanks for joining.

I agree 100% with what you said. I would have also like to have bred Rocko (or Icon / U-Nhan-Rha) to Pantera as well.

If only ... :cry:

Jack


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[MinuteMan]

Glad to be aboard! You've always run the best board in the dogs.

[Officially Retired]

Appreciate that & glad you're here to help keep it that way 8-)

[BREAK'EM KENNELS]

nice job like this broad

[SUNDEVIL]

Glad to hear this works i would think it would ,My family just did a son of CH Mr Serious to a daughter of CH Cortez hoping for great things from these two. http://www.apbt.online-pedigrees.com/mo ... edigrees=1 (http://www.apbt.online-pedigrees.com/modules.php?name=Pedigrees&file=printPedigree&dog_id=410122&myPedigrees=1)

[wrongway]

Sundevil, you got a ped?

[CitySwamp]

Speaking of Mr Serious how is this dog producing,

http://www.apbt.online-pedigrees.com/mo ... _id=337098 (http://www.apbt.online-pedigrees.com/modules.php?name=Pedigrees&file=printPedigree&dog_id=337098)

Also how is the producing career of GrCh Ms Serious going? I heard that was one bad bad bitch..

[SUNDEVIL]

look up rodney dangerfield x westcoast combines shiver

[SUNDEVIL]

Sundevil, you got a ped? not sure if i can post the p-online peds here but the breeding is listed here for you . 8-)

[SwampDweller]

look up rodney dangerfield x westcoast combines shiver

Had SHIVER's littermate sister (JESSICA RABBIT), she was a pretty descent dog, but was out-classed by Gator Boyz' CH. CARABINA 5xw-1xl in :35.