Alligator Blends to Vise Grip Blood or Evolution Kennels Blood?

[No Quarter Kennel]

I owned a dog who was registered as Ferguson's Amos.
He was an exceptional dog for his bloodline. He's what we call in Texas, a pure Tonka-Red Barron dog. I don't agree with that 100% though as the Red Barron dog actually had some Alligator in him by way of Susan Renee (sis to Alligator himself).

However, this blood has always been a mainstay in regards to a great mix with the Alligator blood. A lot of great dogs have come through this blend.

My question is, has anyone using the Vise Grip stuff or the Evo stuff mixed any of this blood with the Alligator stuff and if so, who are these folks. If not, I would be extremely interested in doing so as I KNOW, without doubt, this would be a blend (note: not a cross) that would be very successfull!

Let's hear it!

[Officially Retired]

I owned a dog who was registered as Ferguson's Amos.
He was an exceptional dog for his bloodline. He's what we call in Texas, a pure Tonka-Red Barron dog. I don't agree with that 100% though as the Red Barron dog actually had some Alligator in him by way of Susan Renee (sis to Alligator himself).
However, this blood has always been a mainstay in regards to a great mix with the Alligator blood. A lot of great dogs have come through this blend.
My question is, has anyone using the Vise Grip stuff or the Evo stuff mixed any of this blood with the Alligator stuff and if so, who are these folks. If not, I would be extremely interested in doing so as I KNOW, without doubt, this would be a blend (note: not a cross) that would be very successfull!
Let's hear it!


Ponchday mentioned awhile back that he owned J & J's Ch. Buck (3xW) (http://www.apbt.online-pedigrees.com/modules.php?name=Public&file=printPedigree&dog_id=217268), who won in Mexico over Lacras Kennel's Chamuco 2xw (1:45), Manriquez' Handsome (2xw :45), and for his Ch. Against Merino's Campeoncito 4xw 1:56.

Rosey was Sassy's mama and one of my absolute best bitches. I had sold her as a pup to Junior Martell in So CA, who bred her to this Battendorf male and Ponchoday said Buck was a spectacular dog. (I got Rosey back later, and it was a pity she died at 5 from cancer. Sure wish I knew about feeding raw back then.)

Anyway, I know MOK had a real nice male from you, that he was very high on, and I know he tests his stock hard. So, yes, I for one would be interested in a mix with a clean-bred dog of this family you're proud of. My trouble right now is I don't have too many bitches, and what I do have is getting bred to Silverback until he's dead, and these dogs just don't live much passed 10-12 years of age, so as soon as Silverback can no longer produce I would be willing to try a bitch on a stud you're high on. Would also be willing to breed a bitch you're proud of to Silverback for a pup or two back, if you're interested in going that route.

Thanks for the offer, very generous of you,

Jack

[AmberLamps]

Edit to say: Sorry should of read the question as my answer was not specific to vice-grip or evo blood.

[Officially Retired]

That is too bad ... because I thought you provided a great response about Limey.

I was going to respond, but now I can't :(

[ponchday]

I owned J & J's Ch. Buck (3xW), he was an example of the Alligator/Visegrip blend. He was an excellent [] dog. Never showing any bad signs during his matches. He was a very smart bulldog always adjusting to his oppenents style n beating them with it

[No Quarter Kennel]

Jack, I'll contact you in private about a potential breeding.
I like the responses so far. I would like to know what MTK said about the Limey stuff.
I know he acquired Ch. Candy who was a Tonka Red Baron cross with Park Son. There have been many good ones of this blend. I bred Ferguson's Scout to Ferguson's Kalija and produced a dog named Butcher Girl in east Tx. She was good enough I ended up selling Kalija to the same guys and they tried like hell to buy Scout as well. She was named after her reputation. She would be a 3/4 Alligator 1/4 TRB dog. It's a real good blend.

Let's hear your response MTK - I just want to talk dogs.

[No Quarter Kennel]

http://www.apbt.online-pedigrees.com/modules.php?name=Public&file=printPedigree&dog_id=61834

Example of a real nice blend.

[No Quarter Kennel]

http://www.apbt.online-pedigrees.com/modules.php?name=Public&file=printPedigree&dog_id=17036

Here's one for you. The first dog I ever got from Gary Hammonds was a dog named Hannah. http://www.apbt.online-pedigrees.com/modules.php?name=Public&file=printPedigree&dog_id=64543

She was a great dog. She had heat cycles every 4 months almost to the day. I never got a pup from her at all. Stuck her many times, but hey, I was in my rookie era and was doing my best. Long story short, I never got anything off of her. Bitch could bite bullet holes in hogs.

I wanted to re-create this dog. Hammonds had the Zackitha dog on his yard. This dog was very strange. She literally ate her tail off. She didn't chew it in half and it fall off, she actually started at the tip and ate it all the way up to her ass over the course of several weeks. To say she's a little "off" is an understatement. Oh well, as I've already mentioned, I'm still in my rookie era at this time and I'm thinking this was something I needed to re-create the Hannah dog. I take this bitch from Gary and breed her to Park. This became known as the "Luck Litter" by Hammonds as he believed as I did, this was something good. This litter produced AC/DC's Diablo, my Skeeter dog (who was the best male of the bunch - IMO), and Change of Luck who was an exceptional dog, but was a little psycho like mom. This litter was 3/4 identical to Hannah and proved to be 90% just like her in many ways. It's like Jack says sometimes, it's not as hard as some think.

Just some tidbits on this line and it's success with the Tonka or TRB blends.

[AmberLamps]

That is too bad ... because I thought you provided a great response about Limey.

I was going to respond, but now I can't :(

Sorry Jack.. :embarrassed:





Jack, I'll contact you in private about a potential breeding.
I like the responses so far. I would like to know what MTK said about the Limey stuff.
I know he acquired Ch. Candy who was a Tonka Red Baron cross with Park Son. There have been many good ones of this blend. I bred Ferguson's Scout to Ferguson's Kalija and produced a dog named Butcher Girl in east Tx. She was good enough I ended up selling Kalija to the same guys and they tried like hell to buy Scout as well. She was named after her reputation. She would be a 3/4 Alligator 1/4 TRB dog. It's a real good blend.

Let's hear your response MTK - I just want to talk dogs.


I didn't mention much, just how Limeys foundation bitch Tug was bred very similar to Jacks blood, being essentially Bolio/Tombstone with a boomerang influence through boomerangs brother Petronelli's Fox. Tugs sire Fox jr and Ch Hammers Dam Blitz are actually cousins. And how Limeys whole family was based around Tug bred to dogs heavy in Hammonds Rufus blood, one of which breedings produced a ROM litter.

[evolutionkennels]

I owned a dog who was registered as Ferguson's Amos.
He was an exceptional dog for his bloodline. He's what we call in Texas, a pure Tonka-Red Barron dog. I don't agree with that 100% though as the Red Barron dog actually had some Alligator in him by way of Susan Renee (sis to Alligator himself).

However, this blood has always been a mainstay in regards to a great mix with the Alligator blood. A lot of great dogs have come through this blend.

My question is, has anyone using the Vise Grip stuff or the Evo stuff mixed any of this blood with the Alligator stuff and if so, who are these folks. If not, I would be extremely interested in doing so as I KNOW, without doubt, this would be a blend (note: not a cross) that would be very successfull!

Let's hear it!

I have never been one to advise what to breed to. Jack and I have a mutual respect for our stock. I've alway's told anyone to do all the research, make a rational decision, and only answer to yourself. In the end, you'll be responsible for working your stock, so you should be responsible for deciding what to breed to.

[No Quarter Kennel]

Evo - do you know of anyone using your blood with Alligator stock?

[evolutionkennels]

There is one champion Bitch from Machobuck bred to a Hammonds bitch from Hammonds yard. The guy who owned the dam got struck by lightning and a year later was killed in a motorcycle accident. His name was Cless and was from about an hour north of Houston. (a bit unlucky if you ask me.) So we never could find out how she was bred. She did have a littermate brother who was voted GIS in Texas. I believe his name was Major Wagers. Anyway, She is a legitimate champion.

[No Quarter Kennel]

I remember you asking about that dog. I run it by GH and he didn't have a recollection. I'll be seeing him very soon and will run these details by him again and see if I can't get him to remember.