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For me, it was a great catch phase because it can be interpreted two ways. One, RB/J dogs themselves have more dead game dogs and/or two, by going into a RB/J dog if your dog is game, he indeed will be dead game.
I never put much thought into whether either one was accurate or not. I just thought it was a cool statement.
I think I posted it before, if you were selling these dogs with a billboard, it would be about the best advertisement tag line.
EWO
What was Chavis like?
A little before my time. I never met him. The dog that made him famous was his half of the Red Boy-Jocko dogs, the Ch. Jocko dog.
Back when I was a kid they were referred to as Jocko-Red Boy dogs as Jocko was the half of the breeding that was getting it done. For whatever reason, the Red Boy popularity sky rocketed over the years and in time they became Red Boy-Jocko dogs.
If someone can get CYJ to log on for this topic he can answer this question way better than most any one else.
A bulldog story......There was a dog named Cotton. He was owned by a guy just getting started in the dogs. He listened well and received a lot of help in the first show. Cotton won impressively. When Cotton came back out for #2 his new owner 'did not want help' as he had mastered the dogs. He bought a mill. The keep comprised of the dog running the mill for as long as the 12 pack and a couple of joints would last. On show night Cotton was nothing more than a dish rag. He got drug. The guy looked over and told his corner man I f%^&Ked Cotton up and it was a silent nod in agreement. Cotton made a game scratch and it was all he had. On the other dog's scratch Cotton had nothing left. The other dog toed the line.
On the ride home the first hour was how he regretted f'ing up a good dog. The second hour of the drive after 12 more cold ones, maybe ol' Cotton was not the dog they thought. On the last hour Cotton was a cur and it took the show to find it. The other guy on the driving said he would buy Cotton, his collar, his barrel, his chain and his axle for $300. Cotton was bought just before they got home.
Cotton was put back out there. Mr. Chavis picked the weight up and told everyone he knew that Cotton had nothing left in #2 and did not think he would be all that on his next trip out. He called twice a week to let the new owner know he would be waxed and waxed in short order. He was quite confident and quite full of himself. I always wondered if the confidence was in his dog or the fact Cotton did not show well in #2.
Cotton showed up, in condition, shaped by one of the best ever. Cotton changed Mr. Chavis' mind about a lot fo things that night.
The only information I have.
EWO
Thanks. I always wonder what some of the old school guys were like. I think he’s one I would like to sit and talk to. I spend a lot of time studying pedigrees. I feel like I can look at pedigrees and see the kind of yard he had. He committed fully to red boy
, yellow and Jocko. A lot of his peds were super tight. Triple bred off yellow and red boy bred to double bred Jocko dogs. I wonder what traits he valued how he made his decisions. One thing said he wasn’t well off. Funny you say that about conditioning. I think most dogs get screwed by their owners. That help thing is interesting topic. There’s so much false info out and people value different things.
The Jocko-Red Boy dogs were rough, durable and game. As a family, I would venture to guess they had as many Ch's as any. Not using the title as a marker, but to say the dogs won long hard battles multiple times.
Way back then they were also called dumb ol' Jocko-Red Boy dogs. They would scratch to a sign post. Most would trade. A lot would take more than they gave but the durability and gameness outlasted the next guy.
I seen a number of them lose for an hour plus, and then have enough to be the winner in the end.
One of the better crosses was to the Hollingsworth dogs. If it did nothing else, it amped the intensity level ten times. That intensity and pressure took the family to the next level.
Seeing the same thing when the RBJ stuff is crossed to the Mims family of Snooty-Red Boy dogs.
And meeting Mr. Chavis would have been a pleasure for me as well. I'm as big of fan of the dog's history as I am the dogs themselves. Mr. Chavis played a huge role in where the dogs are at now compared to if he had not played his part in making the cross.
EWO
It would have been good to walk their yards and see how they were. His first breedings did a lot to add to the prepotency of the strain. I wonder if he really thought about it. One thing said he didn't have a lot of money. If what we would call line breedings and inbreedings were really just. "This is where I live. This is what we have. I like how he goes that's his best daughter I want more like him." "How do you know it's too tight?" Breeding won't take or you get one pup. If that happens take him to one of those."
I like those 1/4 3/4 rbj to holingsworth dogs. and 50/50 dogs. I want to concentrate on that section of the universe. I think I'm intense. I like the same in my dogs.
I wish CYJ would chime in.
EWO
What happened to cotton. Was the other dogman a known person?Quote:
Originally Posted by EWO
Cotton was bred a couple of times but not as much as he should have been.
The guy that owned him never really bred any dogs. He kept 8-10-12 dogs that were 'open to the world'. His calling card was conditioning. He won a bunch of matches in the late 70's, 80's and into the early 90's.
His name is really not out there because he never bred, nor sold dogs. Long term, winning and conditioning dogs is lost to breeding and puppy sales. Dogs that produce and people that breed dogs are what get remembered. A dog's accomplishments get devalued if he does not produce more of the same.
The guy I talk about is out of the dogs but still in and around the game. I won't call his name in a public forum. Sort of a respect thing.
Mr. Ozzie Stevens once said his dogs were conditioned as well as any thing he had seen. That was huge statement coming from Mr. Stevens, who is very well one of the greatest shapers ever.
EWO
I wasn’t asking to put his name out there. I always think the best people out there are never really known. I wouldn’t have a large yard. I wouldn’t breed a lot. I’d have a small family and work them. Too many lazy sorry people not knowing their dogs and wasting them and blaming the dogs. It’s just funny that a “no name” took a “good for nothing” dog and beat a solid guy.Quote:
Originally Posted by EWO