underbite in reproduction

[EWO]

When the conversation pops up about under bite/over bite I always think about the performance aspect. Last night we had 9 puppies born and this bitch is undershot. Her flea biters are far enough apart she really struggled with the sacks and that last piece to the imbillical cord. She struggled with the first one, and then the second and from that point I did it for her.

I never thought about teeth structure playing a part in the birthing process. EWO

[Officially Retired]

An underbite that scissors is actually preferred leverage-wise ... however an underbite that is gapped and dysfunctional is not good.

[EWO]

True. I just never factored it to be a detriment to getting a puppy out of a sack or 'scissoring' the cord. Any time the subject of over or under bite came up I just thought about the bite, form to function and such. In the grand scheme of things I had teeth and jaw structure in the performance section not in the birthing process.

Like most, if I had not been there and most of the puppies did not make it would have been her fault, another case of bad mothering. By being there the puppies made it, and in turn, she is doing an excellent job with all nine. EWO

[SteelyDan]

I had a bitch with an under bite that doesn't scissor and she had thrown dogs with the same or worse. She has had 4 litters and never had a problem cutting umbilical cords ever or anything else for that matter. Excellent mother. She just used the sides of her jaws.

[EWO]

This is actually an English Bulldog. She tries to use the side of her jaws but there is so much 'jaw fat' she can't get it to a grinding spot. After a leg quarter she just about needs a bath. The under bite is extreme, even for her kind.

She struggled with the first to the point it may end up being an umbilical hernia as it is still protruding outward more so than the others. The second was beginning to be a struggle so I stepped in. Maybe she figures it out, maybe she does not. I can't say for sure. I just did not wait around to see. S

[Frank43]

Can we resurrect this thread. It has come up. I have been breeding back to try to solidify some traits in an outcross. Some underbites have cropped up. I think most people leave them in. From my understanding they are recessive type traits that are probably polygenetic. One female came out gapped undershot. It seems to be getting worse. I’ll probably cull her. I would probably still breed tight as I feel these individuals are worth it. I did some reading on this subject. There’s a concept called genetic purge. Basically it says as inbreeding goes up. Traits that are homozygous recessive show themselves and can be eliminated. You lose some vigor but it generally corrects with a outcross. My plan going forward is to continue to have some coefficient of inbreeding on broodstock. Limit the genes that come into my gene pool. Evaluate pups early for underbites. If present cull early. Seems you save yourself from having the temptation of a badly undershot dog who is athletic and may be the smartest pup you have.

Any ideas?

[State Bull]

From my experience.. Using dogs with bad bites are genetic and removing that from you line is smart. I have a pure RB dog that is line bred off littermates with a perfect bite. If the bite is slightly under and the canines lock it's not bad. If you bred to a similar type dog you double the fault cause multiple pups with bad mouths.

Just my experience.

[Frank43]

Thanks. The original mom and dad had perfect bites. Only when breeding back to lock in traits have they started to show up. From what I read they are recessive. The pups I kept out of the litter have scissor bites. I know we don’t breed for bites it prob matters. I think the tight breeding uncovers them. Another reason for sticking with a line and family of dogs.