Could the dog men of yesterday compete with the fast lane Dog men of today? I truly don't think the dog's have gotten much better, but I don't think the Dog-men of yesterday years could compete with our conditioning technology, and understanding of the A.P.B.T In today's time, and era ! imo The day's of just mill work is long gone and over... in today's time, IT's down the the damn science.
Last edited by BULLDOG ANONYMOUS; 02-23-2015 at 08:20 PM.
IMHO I beg to differ. Maybe just relearning some minor feed improvements or easier convenient food products that requires less time to prepare. The best dogs of the 70's/80's90's were just as good and powerful back then as some are implying theirs are today. Going the distance of two and three hours back then is no different than going the same time limits today. I have been on some dog yards lately, a dog show, and looked at dogs on the You Tube. Look like the same ole dogs to me just bred down further from the original dogs I knew about in my time era.
The dogs my Father and Uncle had in the 50's when I was a young boy. Were really great looking ole timey Bull Terrier type looking dogs. My Father had some 100% Trice bred dogs. They were rugged, tough hided, hard punishing foul fighting type dogs. Showing deep gaminess yet lots of intelligence. A lot of talk about raw diets today. Most dogs back then were conditioned on a lot of raw meat like horse meat/Cow and glandular meats. Back then dogs were given plenty of raw shank bones to eat and chew. Butchers always had plenty of bones and scrap meat for brood bitches and puppies. Back then a dollar was really worth a dollar based on the Gold standard.
I learned a long time back, the better dogs are generally found on dog yards of owners that take extra good care of their dogs. These type men/women will have the discipline and get up and go to properly work their animals for dog shows. So whether the fast lane or the slow lane. Wise to bring the best dog you can find when showing dogs against these type of dog persons.
The biggest change I am seeing in equipment has been better built Treadmills/Carpet Mills, which I never cared to use that much. These newer ones might change my mind if I was to see a dog personally worked on one.
I put a couple fellows onto the round table and they are liking it a lot. Get one built just right at 16 feet to 20 feet they will be loving it. Their is a picture I have seen of F. Chavis' Jocko working a Jenny Mill made of wood. Mr. Chavis and Son were professional carpenters. Jocko was working that mill and dragging a concrete block on a piece of wire behind him. Jocko was a well built and powerful dog. Jocko at his best pit weight back then would be just as powerful at that weight today. Cheers
good post CYJOriginally Posted by CYJ
Jack could you elaborate a little more on how long or far that Ole timer walked his dogs while pulling that 15 foot chain? Sure he used different weighted chains for the size dog pulling it. The only person that I saw personally work dogs like this was A. Howle along with some round table work.
Never saw his dogs get in trouble for air and were strong as bulls. Always had a big boned dog for the weight. A weak built dog or a dog with any type physical problem, would not hold up long to a keep like that. That chain would definitely bring out the weak links in the dog's body if they are there. LOL
As Jack said, calling the correct weight is huge. Personally, I think it is the foundation to the 'winning' dog. Lots of dogs have a two pound window in which they can perform admirably, some even three. It is simply hard for a really good dog who is smaller to beat a really good dog who is bigger. Calling weight is an art. Lots of times it is the difference between winning and losing when really good dogs are involved.
EWO
I will add this though. If the beginner dog men of my time including me, had access to these newer medications and their proper use. Info. on better chain hook ups and brood pens etc. That is provided and taught in Ca. Jack's book. That would have saved me from learning things the hard way and a lot of money to boot. By having this type info. These younger dedicated dog persons can advance at a much faster pace from the slow lane to the fast lane.
For as a added supplement that balanced the moisture in the dogs lungs without drying it out. Enabled it to breathe very deeply, slowly and cool. No swelling and any blood loss if any was very minimal. Florida Combine and V.J. had that perfected.
Only a handful till this day used it. Even D. Mayfield did not know till V.J. told him. Was a well kept secret for over 30 years till I brought it up. Tried to get some specifics from my Vet. But he changed the subject. So figure it is a discontinued product. Pretty sure it was used primarily on Cattle, heard Dr. Pol on TV mentioned it the other day for a sick cow. Cheers
I think one of the best traits of highly-active old timers is knowing how to call a weight.
I knew an old-timer who had that down to a science. His selection methods were also superior.
He just knew a good dog when he saw one and could really peg the weight, so he's always have the biggest dog at the smallest weight.
He went into many "top conditioners" and beat their ass because he just knew a dog and would always come with the better dog who was bigger at the weight.
He never conditioned; only handwalked and let the dog drag a 15' chain on a hillside.
His motto was, "Jack, if my dog can't go at least an hour, hard, right off the chain, then I don't need that fucken dog."
Jack
Intense Motto, but I like his mentality. I get people giving me shit when I say the same but only :20......lol
The best dogman I personally know said the exact same thing about 2 weeks ago about his conditioning methods.
I think EWO said it right. Top dogmen of yesterday would be top dogmen of today as well.
However, I do NOT believe the conditioning methods of 50 years ago can compete with today's dogs. Just look at pictures. Dogs were conditioned for marathon fights, therefore, you got marathon fights. Dogs are brought in much stronger now days compared to way back then. Thus, not as many multi-hour matches.
That is sort of my point about successful people. Back then the best used what was current and what was available. Todays guy does the same. If yesterday's successful guy could compete with today's successful guy he would figure out the why's and what fors and be successful in this era as well.
The difference in the two is the advances in science with feed and supplementation, especially supplementation. The successful dog man will take advantage of everything out there regardless of his generation.
EWO
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