The breeding Duke to Ringo's Ruby (a daughter to psycho) produced a couple of winners if I recall correctly. This was way before my time so I have no first hand experience. I have some experience of todays staffords though. I must say, if we take in consideration how few fanciers working and breeding their stock the way it should be done the quality is remarkable high. I'm not saying the staffords are in line with the pitbulls, but the worst dogs I've seen were well bred apbts, not staffords. And as Gaba said, if the fanciers hadn't switched to apbts it would be very interesting to see were the staffords would've been today. I have no doubt they would be as good as the pitbulls.