Conditioned Cur

[EWO]

True. But then there are like a million ways to define cur. If we were at a hypothetical show and a dog made a hypothetical chest sliding chin scraping two legged push and gets counted out half way across. There will always be at least one guy who will say if he were game he would have stood up and made his scratch. Based on that comment there will be a guy on the internet proclaiming he would never have bred to that piece of shit since he quit 25 years ago. And he knows this to be true because he knows a guy that knows a guy who saw it. EWO

[Black Hand]

True. But then there are like a million ways to define cur. If we were at a hypothetical show and a dog made a hypothetical chest sliding chin scraping two legged push and gets counted out half way across. There will always be at least one guy who will say if he were game he would have stood up and made his scratch. Based on that comment there will be a guy on the internet proclaiming he would never have bred to that piece of shit since he quit 25 years ago. And he knows this to be true because he knows a guy that knows a guy who saw it. EWO

true, that's why I can only speak for myself cuz we all have different views right or wrong. I didn't read all the comments to see where this thread has gone. my post was for the dog in the original post. I wouldn't call another mans dog a cur if it hasn't quit. I can only control what I feed and really only know my own dogs. there are some weird dogs though. it's ultimately up to the owner who knows him best.

[TFX]

Plenty of game dogs fought a "cur style" but that doesn't make them a cur. Plenty of curs never made a bad sign before they stopped either.

Bobby Smith and I were going to match a little gambler's delight once, but we parted ways before it happened. He was a B grade ability dog that we had proved deeply game, but he screamed from the words "release your dogs". He was really screaming for the fight, not because of it. To the unknowing spectator it didn't sound good! The plan was for Smith to come in on my side and then start betting against me on the scratches. The show would be in front of a lot of people so we could spur others into the same bet and clean house whether we won or lost.

[FrostyPaws]

if the dog never quits, calling him a cur is only speculation. no different than suggesting anything that has never happened no matter how likely it may seem. if it hasn't quit, that's the facts weather you like how he acts or not.

That's simply not the case. See enough dogs go, and you can spot curs, and you don't have to see them actually quit to even know. Perfect example is a bitch from not long ago. Looked good the first 10, then after that, she did a lot of turning, running, and she went from running scratches full bore to walking them. She was picked up. I don't have to SEE that dog quit to know she was a cur. The writing was on the wall for everyone to see. Unfortunately, not everyone can read that particular writing for whatever reasons.

Old man Nate had some type of uncanny ability to spot a cur in a show that never made a bad move. I don't know how he did it, but he did it regularly. I could never read that writing aside from having a certain gut feeling about some.

[R2L]

theres a big difference in a winning dog and dog who was picked up before it could cur out.

[Black Hand]

That's simply not the case. See enough dogs go, and you can spot curs, and you don't have to see them actually quit to even know. Perfect example is a bitch from not long ago. Looked good the first 10, then after that, she did a lot of turning, running, and she went from running scratches full bore to walking them. She was picked up. I don't have to SEE that dog quit to know she was a cur. The writing was on the wall for everyone to see. Unfortunately, not everyone can read that particular writing for whatever reasons.

Old man Nate had some type of uncanny ability to spot a cur in a show that never made a bad move. I don't know how he did it, but he did it regularly. I could never read that writing aside from having a certain gut feeling about some.

that's a far cry from a dog that has won 4.

[Officially Retired]

That's simply not the case. See enough dogs go, and you can spot curs, and you don't have to see them actually quit to even know. Perfect example is a bitch from not long ago. Looked good the first 10, then after that, she did a lot of turning, running, and she went from running scratches full bore to walking them. She was picked up. I don't have to SEE that dog quit to know she was a cur. The writing was on the wall for everyone to see. Unfortunately, not everyone can read that particular writing for whatever reasons.
Old man Nate had some type of uncanny ability to spot a cur in a show that never made a bad move. I don't know how he did it, but he did it regularly. I could never read that writing aside from having a certain gut feeling about some.

Strictly-speaking, concerning the nature of knowledge vs. belief, what you describe isn't "knowledge" at all; it's belief. Even justified belief.

The simple truth is, if you did not see a dog quit, then you do not "know" the dog would have quit, you merely have very strong (even justified) belief that the dog would quit.

I myself have seen a ton of dogs that I was 100% sure that they would have quit, and I may have been right, but my strong beliefs were not "knowledge" either; they were merely very strong, justifiable beliefs.

Only when the dog actually stops, and confirms the justifiable beliefs that we have, do those beliefs then get upgraded to true KNOWLEDGE.

Jack

[EWO]

I was trying to figure the best way to say that as well. There are a few dogs down the road from me that chase cars religiously. I believe with every fiber of my being they will get hit by a car, but until they actually get hit, they are still chasers. I do not know they will get hit but based on my experience odds are they will eventually be hit. A silly comparison I know, but no matter how bad they look until they actually hang it up they are still on the right side of the measuring stick. EWO

[bolero]

That's simply not the case. See enough dogs go, and you can spot curs, and you don't have to see them actually quit to even know. Perfect example is a bitch from not long ago. Looked good the first 10, then after that, she did a lot of turning, running, and she went from running scratches full bore to walking them. She was picked up. I don't have to SEE that dog quit to know she was a cur. The writing was on the wall for everyone to see. Unfortunately, not everyone can read that particular writing for whatever reasons.

Old man Nate had some type of uncanny ability to spot a cur in a show that never made a bad move. I don't know how he did it, but he did it regularly. I could never read that writing aside from having a certain gut feeling about some.

if the dpog wins and does not quit it is nit a cur u can speculate all day and say he will cur but that is like saying all dogs will quit when dead game dogs dont and we can not bring them back to find out

[FrostyPaws]

that's a far cry from a dog that has won 4.

It's not a far cry from a dog that's won 4. Ch.Dahmer was a dog that won 3, and pretty much did the exact same thing for his 4th. He was picked up while standing the line on his turn to scratch. 3x winners or 4x winners have quit throughout history and given bad signs when doing so, so it's not a far cry whatsoever.

R2L, the difference isn't as big as you may think. Ever seen a winning dog not run a courtesy scratch when the other dog quit already?