Convo I once had with Mr Jack Kelly

[bossman311]

You could be right Sir! LOL! You could be right!

[EWO]

Mr. Mims may be the last link to whatever the most correct version is out there.

I'm not sure he would sit down with pen and paper, if he would it would be historical. Two sentences about Red Boy would turn into South Carolina pulp wood before you could take pen to paper.

I was always told the version from Mr. Mims. HC had dogs straight off Red Boy, Bass bred and then Marlowe bred. I was like 10 years old and we walked dogs for HC. (me and his son, different times, different eras).

HC had some of the early Bullet dogs and they were a large part of his yard. The Red Boy dogs off Cleo could bite, even Cat. Red Boy dogs off a lot of other bitches did not show a lot of mouth. He is where I always heard the saying, "The Red Boy dogs are no more game than any other dog, but they can breathe underwater".

Always a great topic.

EWO

[CYJ]

Ditto S_B. I was JJY over on the on lines pedigree site. That was me Boss Man 311. I came over here and used the member name CYJ. You can see over time as my memory became clearer on past events. Some things I might have changed my mind on. I do like those dog's looks and bloodline that Tar Heel Matt and Johnson bred up.

I wanted to breed my Young's Tina bitch to a Lonzo Pratt bred dog named Black Friday that Atlas Brewer had. Was a no go after V. Jackson had won over Atlas several times.

I and my wife did the conditioning and Braddock the owner was the handler of MR. Clean. We had made the match with Atlas and thought our show dog match was with him.

When we got there, were driven around up and down high hills for over a hour, which made our dog car sick. We finally get to the show ring. Too find Mr. Pratt in the other corner with a fresh well conditioned dog.

Braddock's Mr. Clean was not named that for it's all white/red nose/yellow eyes. Even driven four hours and made car sick. Braddock's Mr. Clean still showed Mr. Pratt and Atlas how the west was won. LOL Cheers.

P.S. Braddock's Mr. Cleans pedigree is on this site. Mr. Cleans' Dam was bred out of Cotton's Bullet.

[CYJ]

One member on here wrote a article on his thoughts of breeding certain types of dogs. I certainly agree with most of what he says. Katie Marlowe told me that Bass' Tramp Red Boy's dam, Mc'Cleod's Susie Que Gal. Would let the chickens eat with it out of the feed pan. Was a docile type dog. Maybe even a cold dog.

I never saw Susie Que Gal or got too met Mr. Mc'Cleod. Never heard of Mr. Mc'cleod doing anything with dogs. Except selling puppies through the local news paper. He may have passed on by the time I had gotten into the game.

From the looks of Red Boy, IMHO, I feel there was a strong Corvino gene pool in Bass' Red Boy. Red Boy looked a lot like Corvino's Shorty and the Ross' Red Devil stud dog. Corvino's dogs were not noted for being hard biters but known for deep gaminess. Cheers

[CYJ]

Do a test breeding to Mc'Cleod's Susie Que Gal with Teal's Tip dog. Do a 14 generation search. Just start scrolling down. You will see the good Colby blood. You will also see a lot of Red dogs of Lightner etc. Will see a lot of Corvino's Shorty over and over. IMHO I feel the Corvino genes and the Lightner genes expressed themselves the most in Bass' Tramp Red Boy.

From what I saw Bass' Tramp Red Boy go through. I do believe Red Boy was a very deep to a dead game dog and lived. Cheers

[bossman311]

OH OK! That I was talking to someone else CYJ.

[CYJ]

Ditto bossman 311. I wrote a article on this site about the Tramp Red Boy dog. Title may be Bass' (Martin's ) Red Boy. The Red Boy dog was first owned by Wilbur Martin who also lived in Dillon S.C. I visited and talked with him over the years back then. He sold Red Boy to Bass. No longer sure how old Red Boy was before sold. Wilbur did breed Red Boy to some of his Loposay Colby/Loposay Bullet II females. Martin had some of that Carver's (Loposay's) Tiger Jack dogs as well.

I owned and gave a great little black/white bitch named Liz to my brother. Liz was sired by Red Boy x one of Wilbur's Bullet bred females. Saw this little Liz bitch rolled on a big bitch dog and was beat down and appeared dead. Was able to be revived, and once seeing the bigger roll dog. Scratched right back into that big rough dog and took a solid holt. Now I did not approve of doing that. Was not my dog though.

Liz full brother was owned by Rowell and proved to be a hard biting dead game dog. EWO knows a whole lot more about those Red Boy x Loposay Bullet dogs than I do. The ones I saw had a good mouth and were deep game. Liz had a gimp back leg and could not be properly conditioned. My brother raised one litter off Liz, but no longer know where or what happened to the off spring. Cheers

[EWO]

I would defer to CYJ based on his knowledge and most of all his first hand experience. I think now the foremost expert now would be Mr. Mims. He has the first hand knowledge from years ago and then 30-40 years of breeding the strain. I'm not in either of those ballparks.

As a young kid I petted a couple off Red Boy. The first did not have a lot of mouth but he had one gear and it was all out. As some would say, he could breathe under water and he was coming all night. It seems like they killed him three or four times but as it was also said, there must have been three or four hairs on the tip of his tail still alive and that is all a Red Boy dog needs to make scratch.

I have heard it both ways from way back then but the other was a male that was either a litter mate to Yellow John or a repeat breeding. No idea which way. This one was called JR. He had pretty good mouth but not enough to write home about. He too had all night desire and not only knocked on death's door he kicked it and walked right in. It was said, 'he will die for your money'.

How Red Boy was bred and how Red Boy came about has been more lore than fact since the 80's. From the 80's on the number of people with first hand knowledge dwindled. That number now is maybe less than a handful and I am not one of the handful.

The guy that turned me onto the dogs was a funny guy and he was known to shoot curves. A good guy in the dogs but he could sure tell a story. His mom once told us that he would rather stand on top of a telephone pole on one foot in the high wind and tell a lie just so he did not have to stand on the ground to tell the truth. That was from his own mom.

He would tell us how Red Boy was bred. Then one of the Red Boy dogs would show a lot of mouth and he would say that is that Bullet blood I told you about. The next time a puppy would be born and there would be some white or brindle and he would say there is that Colby blood I told you about. Then a heavy red boy breeding would throw a black dog and he would say I told you those son of a bitches lied about how he was bred.

It was like Red Boy was bred differently every time one of his offspring showed a different trait.

Those days seem like a hundred years ago.

EWO