Should Showing EXTREME GAMENESS be Part of DOY Candidacy?

[Officially Retired]

What does it mean if, when we go out onto our yard of 20-30 dags, we say .... This one here is a BULLDOG!

Are we saying, This dog is a super-high-ability dog ... only?

Or are we saying, This one here WILL NOT STOP ... or is a WARHORSE ... with an outstanding combination of ability + proven resolve/gameness?

[S_B]

That was well said.

However, I am not sure I can agree that Homer wouldn't get votes for Dog of the Year ... I absolutely think he would (if not even Decade/Lifetime) by the people who saw him go.

Also, what if we changed the title to BULLDOG of the Year ... does the word Bulldog not carry the implication of tenacity/deep gameness with it??

Jack

Jack,

No denying Homer and his gameness. But on that day the better dog won, circumstances, excuses, conditioners, weight aside. Jeep was the dog that beat one of the best during that calendar year. For that accomplishment Jeep would be considered the best.

I think it is a matter of what DOY has meant throughout the years as we all who were subscribers of the SDJ were conditioned to believe. Which was who was the most accomplished dog to be recognized in that calendar year. Or which dog Jack Kelly fancied most. And at that time the gamest dog during each show was awarded GIS.

According to this poll it is a matter of feelings or interpretation. One may feel the dog who displays what the epitome of this breed means, gameness is the best. While another may feel one who can out perform the best at the current time is the best.

I feel the addition of a "Gamest Dog of the Year" award is a good thing. But I think the performance record of the opponent would need to be a consideration which may or may not be fair. As two first time out dogs realistically could display deeper gameness.

Giving this more thought, what would be a determining factor to achieve this award? If you go on time at nearly 4 hours of action who's to say Homer was actually more game than Jeep? Because he was behind, and not brought in correctly? Or could Jeep have been determined more game because of his dominating and winning? It gets down to splitting hairs and what one interprets vs. another.

Something to think about...

S_B

[Officially Retired]

I disagree completely that "the better dog won" between Jeep and Homer ...

I can think of a lot of great dogs who lost only because their weight wasn't right, they were brought in underweight/bad condition, etc.

That said, I very much do agree with the general idea of DOY being a title of Most Accomplished dog of the year ...

However, isn't showing extreme, 100% dead gameness an "accomplishment" ... arguably even the most important accomplishment?

Is winning/losing the only relevant criteria?

Jack

PS: You didn't answer my question about the title BULLDOG of the Year ... if that has an added implication of "proven gameness" to it?

[arsuffi@att.net]

I disagree completely that "the better dog won" between Jeep and Homer ...

I can think of a lot of great dogs who lost only because their weight wasn't right, they were brought in underweight/bad condition, etc.

That said, I very much do agree with the general idea of DOY being a title of Most Accomplished dog of the year ... however, isn't showing extreme, 100% dead gameness an accomplishment ... arguably even the most important accomplishment?

Jack

yes

[Officially Retired]

Let me put it another way:

Which is the most difficult/important thing for any dog to prove it can do:

1) Win a match where the animal is more physically gifted than its foe?

or

2) Fight a toe-to-toe, back-and-forth fight, with 100% determination, until the last breath of life escapes it?

To which scenario should our highest honors be given to a bulldog?

Jack

[loot]

Gameness is something we all want our dogs to have but many times a dog that shows extreme gameness is on the losing side of the contest. Some do show that gameness and come out the winner and either case are awarded GIS. Doy is reserved to that special animal who shows that ability to not really get put behind and win convincingly in each and every contest such as the Titere's, The Awesome Beasts, the Barracudas. Doy is reserved for those truly special animals who IMO don't have to show extreme gameness

Well said Mister

[S_B]

I disagree completely that "the better dog won" between Jeep and Homer ...

I can think of a lot of great dogs who lost only because their weight wasn't right, they were brought in underweight/bad condition, etc.

That said, I very much do agree with the general idea of DOY being a title of Most Accomplished dog of the year ...

However, isn't showing extreme, 100% dead gameness an "accomplishment" ... arguably even the most important accomplishment?

Is winning/losing the only relevant criteria?

Jack

PS: You didn't answer my question about the title BULLDOG of the Year ... if that has an added implication of "proven gameness" to it?

Homer should have never met Jeep, but he did and he lost.

That is another argument in of itself, managers of fighters making poor decisions.

As far as extreme gameness being an accomplishment, I don't know if I'd say that necessarily as an accomplishment is defined as a performance. Does one perform gameness or display it?

To answer the question of "Bulldog" of the year...I'll say it's splitting hairs or playing into ones interpretation vs. anothers.

I believe we are both right in our own minds, I don't think there is an absolute answer therfore it is all subjective.

S_B

[S_B]

Let me put it another way:

Which is the most difficult/important thing for any dog to prove it can do:

1) Win a match where the animal is more physically gifted than its foe?

or

2) Fight a toe-to-toe, back-and-forth fight, with 100% determination, until the last breath of life escapes it?

To which scenario should our highest honors be given to a bulldog?

Jack

Put this way #2 all day everyday!

[loot]

What about a dog who does just enough to win in each show? Meaning the better it's opponent is the better they are?

[Officially Retired]

I believe we are both right in our own minds, I don't think there is an absolute answer therfore it is all subjective.
S_B

I think you're right too ... for the reasons you state ...

Put this way #2 all day everyday!

However, this is also right ... and therein lies The Paradox of Truth