stud dogs brood bitches and dog prizes in general. and the ""Justification"" in

[projectx]

Projectx I do not have to justify myself. i was asking the forum members the question. you might whant to respond to the question.. and we take it from there

Hi limey , i think i responed in some detail, and you may not feel the need to justify what you ask in stud fees , but i feel that it would be of interest as to how you come to your stud fee considering all the points i raised in my post, and im sure the memebrs on here would like to know how you arrive at such a high stud fee compared to many other well known ch dogs and thats without the extra costs any prospective buyer of a stud from your dog would incurr in the extra fees i outlined .

[gabbagabbahey]

Regarding the liquid nitrogen container you had to hire,i have only recently been told of a much cheaper alternative which serves the same purpose,but is disposable & one way. So basically you buy the container & it is sufficient to keep the frozen at the right temperature for four or so days,giving ample time to reach the freezing bank.
Haven't looked further on this,but I would appreciate any input if anyone knows of or has used one.
Sounds very similar to the type which Jack mentions in his DVD,regarding using semen extender in fresh sperm.
Apologies for straying LK. If I get a short reply,then I will open a new thread

[projectx]

Regarding the liquid nitrogen container you had to hire,i have only recently been told of a much cheaper alternative which serves the same purpose,but is disposable & one way. So basically you buy the container & it is sufficient to keep the frozen at the right temperature for four or so days,giving ample time to reach the freezing bank.
Haven't looked further on this,but I would appreciate any input if anyone knows of or has used one.
Sounds very similar to the type which Jack mentions in his DVD,regarding using semen extender in fresh sperm.
Apologies for straying LK. If I get a short reply,then I will open a new thread

Hi , yes there are one way disposable containers called CRYODRUMS, and having looked into this in some detail i can tell you that they are not relaible for air shipping, they seem to be very easily broken and there have been many cases of semen ariving and they contianer has lost its capacity to keep it frozen. The people who i talked to said that they would only use it for ground shipping ,but for any air shipping and to be sure your semen arrives safely to use the dry shippers that usually need shipping back to the semen center they came from .The one way disposable containers are in theory supposed to do the job , but doing my research i found out that there have been many case were the containers failed .

BelOW are so,e reports from a people using the disposable containers , and as in this case many vets and facilties that store and ship frozen semen will not use the disposable containers for the same reasons outlined below .That said if you want to take a chance and the semen is not rare or expensive , maybe trying the disposable could be a more cost effective way to go , but i personally decided to take the hit of the shipping on the dry shipper both ways as the semen was not going to be available again .

BELOW ARE SOME REPORTS FORM USER OF THE CRYODRUM

My repro. vet feels the same way about them as Sunnydays' does. She had an entire shipment of a client's semen lost when the disposable shattered and also doesn't like the fact that the semen is exposed to ambient temperature as she removes it. She will no longer accept semen sent in a disposable.

May. 5, 2010, 05:24 AM
Just in reference to the few threads about Cryodrums... we just had another shipment go bad. A new Cryodrum, filled as per instructions to the correct weight etc. failed to hold and thawed out 8 straws of semen that was sent overnight.

It didn't even hold for 20 hours! It's the 2nd time this has happened to us (I was told the first time was a 1 in 1,000,000; and we haven't sent 999,999 shipments since then!), and heralds the end of us using Cryodrums... it's a shame because the product is a good idea, but that lack of reliability makes it impossible for us to continue using them.

Just our experience and my opionion, of course!


I have had five shipments with Cryodrum in the last 12 months. Two have worked, one of which was because I took it from the National Stud stocking centre to the UK in my car. The other three have lost 6 doses of Flipper d'Elle and two doses of Mighty Magic (two of these shipments Jamie was talking about above).

Yes, they were a good idea and are manufactured about 20 minutes from my farm, but I now cannot trust them with 3 out of five going wrong.

As well, my vet says she worries because the internal container is of an easily shattered material (as in some drinking thermoses), and she doesn't think it could withstand falls or hard knocks. I would be reluctant to use, unless I was carrying it in my own car for a trip of some hours.

I hope this helps you , but my advice is use the dry shipper unless your able to ground ship , but most semen banks dont like to ship frozen semen unless they use a dry shipper so if the semen you want to ship to your local repro vet is one of those that wont use anything else but a dry shipper .
I know ground shipping a dry shipper is not so expensive as air shipping and if you are looking to ship inside the usa the ground shipping cost is not like someone having to dry ship internationaly which can cost upwards of $1000 to $2000 plus .

Ps the type mentioned in ca jacks dvds are fresh semen containers there cheap to buy but only for fresh chilled semen not frozen ok.

[The Old Timer.]

Asking higher prices ..Tought i opend this topic, to get a debate going.

why don't you get the debate going by answering the question project is asking you ! or are you waiting for someone to jump to your defense because you cant get your head around it yourself, we are all ears.

[splash747]

JMO...beating a dead horse, negotiate if you like or move on.

[Limey Kennels]

Hi limey , i think i responed in some detail, and you may not feel the need to justify what you ask in stud fees , but i feel that it would be of interest as to how you come to your stud fee considering all the points i raised in my post, and im sure the memebrs on here would like to know how you arrive at such a high stud fee compared to many other well known ch dogs and thats without the extra costs any prospective buyer of a stud from your dog would incurr in the extra fees i outlined .

Projecx it is obviusly that watever i am going to state that you wil find a way to argue as it is seems to be a personal thing for you. Please tell us your justification when your putting a high stud sirvis out, if you do and why and when.
I akt because i like to know what peoples motivations are putting out a high$$ stud fees.. .

[Limey Kennels]

why don't you get the debate going by answering the question project is asking you ! or are you waiting for someone to jump to your defense because you cant get your head around it yourself, we are all ears.

chek post above..

[The Old Timer.]

chek post above..

don't you answer me with check post above, answer the question or are you waiting for someone to come to your defense,

[Limey Kennels]

I awnser the way i whant. i stick to the topic and let no one lure me into a pissing contest....

[projectx]

Projecx it is obviusly that watever i am going to state that you wil find a way to argue as it is seems to be a personal thing for you. Please tell us your justification when your putting a high stud sirvis out, if you do and why and when.
I akt because i like to know what peoples motivations are putting out a high$$ stud fees.. .

Hi limey , i dont see were you think that whatever you say i will find a way to argue witj you i think i was very clear in my post, and i can see by the reaction of others that they also feel that it would be interesting to hear why you feel the stud fee on kingpin is worth the $2.700 fee ,plus the extra costs associated with a breeding as you will only accept breeding from outside the whole of europe ,which means anyone wanting to breed to knigpin would neeed to spend at least $6000 and maybe upt0 $8000 depending on shipping and unforseen vets costs etc , so i think as this is not a normal circumstance and cost for breeding to a dog , especially a dog with no record of any kind ,that maybe you could explain it to us as so far it looks like you are avoiding having to answer ,and the only reason i can think of would be becasue you really cant justify the stud fee and the rules you lay out for breeding to him so you decide to avoid answering at all.

On another point about the rules you impose to breed to knigpin as to who can breed to him and what females etc, i know as in the case of the stud fee you can impose whatever rules you wish ,but i say this to you and others who also impose various restrictions as to who and what etc when studing out thier dog, it is a false feeling to think that if you let out your blood close to you that you will somehow loose the monopoly on that blood, as especially today with all the ways of geting a breeding to a dogs via fresah or frozen semen apart from just buying a live pup or dog from someone who may already have had a dog or breeding from a breeder like you , it seems futile to impose restrictions like that at all, and secondly if a dog is a true producer he should produce with any female no matter how she is bred , that is what a prepotent dog is and of course you would expect a dog to produce even better with similarly bred or family bred females , but we should not be afriad to breed to whoever has the money to want a breeding to any female, as this allows the dog to show his true producing potency and if he is a true prepotent producer then that will also increase his chance of having a very good producing record ,so those breeders should believe more in the blood they use and stud out,and not be affraid to let anyone breed a female which may not be bred the way you or they like to him for fear that afterwards the word is that the dog isnt a producer , and only try to breed to females you or they think will enhance his record ,this type of thinking in breeding should be saved for our own personal breedings , but i say breed them females and lets see if a dog is a true prepotent male or just average and not panic if its the latter turns out to be true.