Top quality canned meat dog food with added supplements in a keep???

[CYJ]

Here is another feed subject to ponder over. I have seen this done by Rowell many years back. Did not know if Rowell was using this feed during a pre keep to reduce weight. Are He used the canned dog food meat all the way through the total work program. Yet it might have been a temporary ploy to confuse some of his competitions,ones that wanted to come over every week. To hopefully check out how his dog was progressing. Sure he nipped that in the bud after one too many unnecessary visits. LOL

At that time knowing very little about feeding a dog. I could only wonder that maybe the moisture to protein/fat content would be similar to raw flesh like a wild dog eats. Except it had been cooked. Once again maybe proper enzymes/correct level of fats/greens/etc. could be added to offset what was lost in the cooking process.

Have been told some dog men had used canned/kibble dog food combo to condition a dog for a dog show. Anyone seen this type feed keep used or with added kibble with any success. Cheers

[EWO]

When mixing in the greens and cheeses and supplements I have known a couple who used the canned food to mask those other ingredients so the dog would readily eat them, especially if the supplements were in powder form.

I couldn't say whether it was used more as a source of nutrition or more as the masking agent. That was a long time ago. I would imagine the moisture content would give it a leg up on its same name brand dry food counterpart.

EWO

[CYJ]

Ditto EWO. This may be a good way to safely reduce a dog to it's best show weight. I pulled up the nutritional info on this dog canned food called Natural Balance L.I.D. ingredients. This brand is based on Chicken/Chicken Livers and Sweet Potato. Sure there are some much better ones that can be bought. The L.I.D. stands for limited ingredient diets. Was no soy/corn/wheat/dyes etc. in this formula.

The nutrition info on this Natural Balance (L.I.D.) did not give the total caloric per can. Seems I have seen listings of 300 to 400 calories a can on canned dog food from years back.

The crude protein is 5.5% min/fat is 3.5% min/crude fiber is 1.5% max and 78% moisture on this particular brand of canned dog food. Now if the moisture was reduced to 12%. The protein/fat values etc. may show much higher. Use to know this stuff, knowledge long forgotten. LOL

It is a known fact that to increase the endurance of a dog by up to 75%. You have to increase the water to enable the dog to burn more fat. Dogs work cooler and longer off a proper fat energy than excessive carbs. Sometimes people get confused on the water issue from those older dog keeps from the past. To deny or restrict a dog's water intake except around the last 24 to 12 hours IMHO is not a wise thing to do. Especially if dog is on weight.

Where we live maybe a canned dog feed keep may work the best in the hot weather months and a more meat/kibble in the cold months. At the time I saw Rowell using canned dog food, it was in the hot weather months.

Times keep a changing. When I first got into the dog game, many believed Horse meat was the best choice of meat to use. Today we know whole chicken works the over all best with the skin and fat intact. Cheers

[Kendall Hoyle]

I am a young seedling, but have the interest. I believe that human grade raw, is best to feed your Canine athlete, companion,
Big company feed, is far from home. Your human touch and selection is good. If you purchase a company
Food and then feel the need to add to balance, is this not double work, and cost. My best

[EWO]

Things change because it is hard for people to change. Not that statement makes much sense....but here goes.

If the guy that turns me onto dogs is wining with corn flakes and cabbage. And in turn I start winning with corn flakes and cabbage, anyone would be hard pressed to convince me otherwise.

The down the road a guy uses horse meat, canned food, raw chicken, fatty beef, etc. etc. etc. and he beats me then people will sway to his way of thinking. That is how things changes in these dogs because it is not a legal sport.

If it were greyhound racing or sled pulling there are numerous studies out there to point a young guy in the direction of scientifically feeding the canine athlete. The bulldog guy must pick a little from the greyhounds and the sled dogs and factor it to bulldogs. When he does that, and wins, others follow suit. Then we have change.

As far as double work, it depends on where you are coming from. If you use a kibble based diet you must add water. If you use a raw food diet water must be added to ensure hydration. The canned food is mostly water so one may not have to add water.

To have someone point at you and say "Black dog the winner" late on a Saturday night, people want to know what you did, not how hard you worked to get there.

EWO

[CYJ]

Ditto EWO, that is so true about all the questions that are asked when specific dog men are on a winning streak. I have listen to dog men ask V.J. questions about how he fed but never how much work was involved in his keep. V.J. had some young marines to help him, V.J. still over saw the AM work, did the majority of the work in the P.M himself.

He gave these persons honest answers,but many would laugh at him and accuse him of telling a tall tale. LOL What many wanted to hear was what was the secret drug keep one was using. They were looking for a lazy man's keep and let the drugs do the winning for them. Never seen any of them win.

When I was with Mr. Teal and Mr. Skinner down in Georgia at a dog show. I went to the concession stand to get a meal before the next event kicked off. Some men walked up to me. Asked me if I knew Mr. Teal real well. I said yes I knew him and Mr. Skinner.

One paid for my meal and they sat down with me while I was enjoying my free eats. One of the men started asking me questions of what Mr. Teal fed his dog and how was he able to pull a dog so tight and keep it's strength.

I grinned and told them how would I know,I was their designated driver. Told them, Mr. Teal was over near the show ring, go ask him. He would be the only person too know that. These fellows departed from me like a New York minute. LOL

I was never sure that Andy Howle had the best feed keep that was used by others. Still he was very consistence and dedicated in his daily working of his dogs. His work method was very similar to what your senior friend was doing along with pulling a weight so far and walking between sessions. Andy beat Bass/Mr. Gainey/Middleton/ and many others. He worked my Young's Face bitch for her two wins. Face was in great shape and strong as a bull.

So yes one has always got to factor in the work ethnic. When I worked that Mr. Clean dog owned by Braddock. Getting up at 05:00 Am, then 8 to ten hours of work that day. Out with the dog till around 12:00 pm.

About two thirds into that eight week keep. Out on a long dark wooded road walking this wonderful dog. I was thinking,this is really a lot of work. I could be making some good overtime money with my company. With all these hours I am putting in. LOL Yet that day Mr. Clean was declared the winning dog over a good dog of Mr. Pratt. It was worth it all. Cheers

[S_B]

Great thread fellas!

[EWO]

One of the better conditioned dogs I have ever seen was conditioned by her being on a long heavy chain, a 2lb weight collar and a five gallon bucket of rocks. The only effort she'd give is chasing the Australian Shephard who was chasing the rocks. Most mornings I was calling for a relief pitcher as my elbow and shoulder felt like I was throwing a nine inning game every morning. Turns out it was the easiest keep I ever did. I sat on a bucket while the dog did all the work. She went into 'the beehive' for 61 minutes with a camp and dog that was 'above her paygrade'.

At 61 minutes she was as fresh and full of energy as she was at 10-20 or 30 minutes. The pace was unreal and her physicality was something to see. All in all, by comparison no real effort on my part. I should have sold a video on 'rock chunking conditioning'.

That does not happen a lot. A lot of times when it comes to the art of conditioning, the art is plain and simple hard work.

If a feed plan can get the dog fuled up correctly and it saves a guy a few seconds/minutes a day ( canned food ) it can be a valuable part of the deal. If a person pre-mixes their meals for convenience and time saving, then picking one up off the shelf would be even better. I speak with a 'forked' tongue as in one breath it is all about hard work and the next it is about being a little smarter.

EWO

[arsuffi@att.net]

One of the better conditioned dogs I have ever seen was conditioned by her being on a long heavy chain, a 2lb weight collar and a five gallon bucket of rocks. The only effort she'd give is chasing the Australian Shephard who was chasing the rocks. Most mornings I was calling for a relief pitcher as my elbow and shoulder felt like I was throwing a nine inning game every morning. Turns out it was the easiest keep I ever did. I sat on a bucket while the dog did all the work. She went into 'the beehive' for 61 minutes with a camp and dog that was 'above her paygrade'.

At 61 minutes she was as fresh and full of energy as she was at 10-20 or 30 minutes. The pace was unreal and her physicality was something to see. All in all, by comparison no real effort on my part. I should have sold a video on 'rock chunking conditioning'.

That does not happen a lot. A lot of times when it comes to the art of conditioning, the art is plain and simple hard work.

If a feed plan can get the dog fuled up correctly and it saves a guy a few seconds/minutes a day ( canned food ) it can be a valuable part of the deal. If a person pre-mixes their meals for convenience and time saving, then picking one up off the shelf would be even better. I speak with a 'forked' tongue as in one breath it is all about hard work and the next it is about being a little smarter.

EWO

EWO agree with everything you said one of my easiest keeps was with a bulldog that was hooked into CH. Mojo a dog associated with some great old timers Mojo beat two CH'S in his first and second outing, the owner after number two, was complaining that nobody would match into Mojo, after hearing this for 20 mins and being young said I would skull drag Mojo with a roll dog with no teeth. O.Stevens said Copperhead you have to take his offer or stay quiet. All I did was sit down stairs on a lawn chair and my wife sat on the bed two floors up and called him up and down the stairs he loved pets and hugs, at One hour 38 mins I have a picture of Mojo laying on his side my dog walked to his crate and got in with no help my feed was 80 % canned 20 % dry nothing else . Mojo was sold over seas not to long after that I also want to say Mojo was a very game bulldog maybe dead game if left in a little longer. Yours in the game Johnny

[EWO]

Your story is similar to mine. Just like mine people would rather hear about an elaborate feed plan, brutal work routines, and supplements/steroids. Simple food and simple work is just that, too simple. Old folks say people will believe the lie far easier than the truth.

Similar plan I knew a guy once who put his dog on a cable run going down a steep heel. The dog would fetch like a retriever. He threw a ball down the hill and the dog would shoot down there and come back up the hill a fast clip just to do it again. This turned out ot be a staple of the work. We laughed as he would give every dog he owned a chance to play this game but most would not. Damn nar begging.

Another we had was a female obsessed with a ball made out of rolled up socks. A little larger than a softball. It was an all out dead sprint after that ball every time it went airborne. The staple of her keep was my buddy and I standing 20 yards or so apart throwing the ball back and forth. She was a freak specimen after four or five weeks.

It is funny how well the simple stuff works.

Too bad the dogs can't be programmed for the 'right' obsessions.

Great story on the steps.

EWO